'the burden of being Lincoln'

[Buntz]

I assume that burden is being owned by Ford Motor Company. Lincoln's stale range and lack of vision, direction, and the funds/approval to get there.

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/09/11/f...being-lincoln/

For at least two years, the plot lines concerning Lincoln have been "How much longer until Ford kills it?" and then "How much longer until Ford turns it around?" We were told that the 2013 MKZ would begin the resurrection of a brand that many felt nostalgia for, but not love (not unlike Cadillac of not so long ago). But Lincoln knows it can't get back in the good books with just one new model; Ford's global marketing chief, Jim Farley, clued Automotive News into the lengths Lincoln will go to get customers' attentions again.

Calling it "the burden of being Lincoln," Farley said that the company's duty is to "remove any barrier that would prevent people from considering a Lincoln, taking a test drive and deciding to buy." That means a "massive" and experiential marketing campaign called, in the interim, "Reimagined," that not only wants to make the case for the brand and its cars but give consumers plenty of ways to get into those cars and drive them. Perhaps most importantly, the campaign aims to do this with younger consumers: 65 is the average age of the Lincoln owner, Farley would like to get that particular demographic way down to the 35-50 bracket.

In attempt to make the most of every interaction, Farley said Lincoln will inaugurate at 24/7 "concierge service" that offers live sales reps to help customers build and price an MKZ. It will also rebrand itself Lincoln Motor Company, which is a bit of a head-scratcher, but apparently they've determined that that's what will resonate better with the "cultural progressive magicians" and "agile visionaries" in the 35-50 age group they're after. The push will commence with a music performance on November 26, around the time of the Los Angeles Auto Show. We don't have details on the event yet, but it will be live-streamed on the website that's home for the campaign.

That's because Ford... only 63 year olds would pay for the luxury of what is basically the highest trim level of a donor Ford. And 35-50 years olds would be buying the Mustang. Or going elsewhere if wanting four doors. And more discerning customers would just buy a Ford.

You need something that's not just luxurious, but is in itself a luxury, in existence, and to own, has no other purpose but itself. That would be performance coupes and saloons. We know where you can get some... you own them too.

[Brazen]

Lincoln and Acura, the two most pointless brands in the automotive world. Ford should of kept Land Rover, Jaguar and Volvo and dumped Lincoln.

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Lincoln and Acura, the two most pointless brands in the automotive world. Ford should of kept Land Rover, Jaguar and Volvo and dumped Lincoln.

That's because when Ford owned Jag, LR, and Volvo, they invested money in developing good product. They can always do the same with Lincoln, though they haven't yet because they were focused (no pun intended) on Ford product. They need to do to Lincoln what they did with the XF and XJ. I think Ford will get there, and Lincoln wasn't a priority when the company was on the verge of bankruptcy in a struggling economy.

[Brazen]

Originally Posted by chevypower

That's because when Ford owned Jag, LR, and Volvo, they invested money in developing good product. They can always do the same with Lincoln, though they haven't yet because they were focused (no pun intended) on Ford product. They need to do to Lincoln what they did with the XF and XJ. I think Ford will get there, and Lincoln wasn't a priority when the company was on the verge of bankruptcy in a struggling economy.

Ford got rid of the Land Rover and Jaguar because it wasnt profitable within 30 seconds of investing into them, Ford being a US run company had management who were more concerned about their next financial quarter bonuses than the longer-term.

With the booming Chinese and Indian upper middle classes, Jaguar and Land Rover are in a great position to ride their luxury image into the future. These brands also contributed to a lot of technology which spread into Ford vehicles - look at the diesel in the Ford Territory.

Lincoln is a tweener brand which doesnt work anymore, people expect the latest gadgets in their mainstream cars and they are no longer going to accept Ford vehicles being held back to give Lincoln some tech superioty. the amount of features, performance and technology in Ford vehicles make Lincoln redundant.

Lincoln no longer has an advantage over the donor Ford vehicles as people want everything in their Ford cars, even Kia have cars with the gear approaching vehicles 5 times the price. The way to position your luxury vehicles is with style, reputation and image -something that Land Rover/Range Rover and Jaguar have in spades, Lincoln is a joke in comparison.

[Dr Smith]

Originally Posted by Brazen

Ford got rid of the Land Rover and Jaguar because it wasnt profitable within 30 seconds of investing into them, Ford being a US run company had management who were more concerned about their next financial quarter bonuses than the longer-term.

With the booming Chinese and Indian upper middle classes, Jaguar and Land Rover are in a great position to ride their luxury image into the future. These brands also contributed to a lot of technology which spread into Ford vehicles - look at the diesel in the Ford Territory.

Lincoln is a tweener brand which doesnt work anymore, people expect the latest gadgets in their mainstream cars and they are no longer going to accept Ford vehicles being held back to give Lincoln some tech superioty. the amount of features, performance and technology in Ford vehicles make Lincoln redundant.

Lincoln no longer has an advantage over the donor Ford vehicles as people want everything in their Ford cars, even Kia have cars with the gear approaching vehicles 5 times the price. The way to position your luxury vehicles is with style, reputation and image -something that Land Rover/Range Rover and Jaguar have in spades, Lincoln is a joke in comparison.

That's not quite right. Ford spent a packet and a half buying them, and even more upgrading their production etc and then faced another round of several $Billion dollars in outlays for the next generation of models. All the while never receiving anywhere near the return required and huge losses generally. With the parent bleeding at the time or needing to put it's capital where it would provide the greatest return i can see how their decision was right for the time. The new Range Rover has been over a $Billion alone, then there's the Sports to come, Disco next, add the next gen of Volvo's, and then money spent by Jag getting out the current XJ and soon the XK replacement...and you can see that a massive capital outlay was needed. I guess without them Ford has done very well financially but I think they need to get more bold now.

[OzJavelin]

Personally I think Licoln has some great heritage .. Hot Rod Lincoln anyone?

I just browsed there website, and what a lineup of ugly, boring cars. The need to inject a bit of "bad boy" image to these tanks like Chrysler did with the 300. As the saying goes, "you can sell an old man a young mans car, but you can't sell a young man an old mans car" (that doesn't explain why so many Toyotas are sold??)

[RASER]

Originally Posted by OzJavelin

Personally I think Licoln has some great heritage .. Hot Rod Lincoln anyone?

I just browsed there website, and what a lineup of ugly, boring cars. The need to inject a bit of "bad boy" image to these tanks like Chrysler did with the 300. As the saying goes, "you can sell an old man a young mans car, but you can't sell a young man an old mans car" (that doesn't explain why so many Toyotas are sold??)

Packard had THE BEST heritage, image and engineering, sadly left the building but the building is still standing in Detroit 313....just

[aussie muscle]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

While Lincoln only do luxury fwd, then the only market you are going to attract is retiries and brand loyalists who don't look under the hood and care only about the thickness and smell of the leather.

luke makes a good argument. I don't have any answers for what Lincoln should do, but cadillac made their cars appeal to wannabe gansters and have been doing quite well as a result.

Lincoln probably needs more autonomy. being shackled to doing what Ford wants them to do seems to be severely limiting their ability to differentiate themselves. I'm sure lincoln know what they need to do, but can't because of the platforms and parts they are required to use from Ford. They are only going to look like 'tarted up fords' until they do something about it.

[Bossxr8]

Maybe the should "re-imagine" a RWD luxo barge like they used to sell in droves

Lincoln Continental anyone?



Imagine a modern interpretation of this, what an image maker and a way to get Lincoln noticed again.


Making tarted up FWD/AWD V6 Fusions and Taurus's just isn't going to do it.

[XR Martin]

From 2002...

[2011G6E]

I notice "rear wheel drive" being wheeled out again as one of the prime points a car should have.

I would bet lefty that the average person buying a Lincoln never even opened the bonnet themselves and wouldn't know and wouldn't care which end was doing the driving, to say nothing of the fact that a Lincoln isn't a "performance car" it's a luxury barge. Too much emphasis on one mechanical point.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by 2011G6E

I notice "rear wheel drive" being wheeled out again as one of the prime points a car should have.

I would bet lefty that the average person buying a Lincoln never even opened the bonnet themselves and wouldn't know and wouldn't care which end was doing the driving, to say nothing of the fact that a Lincoln isn't a "performance car" it's a luxury barge. Too much emphasis on one mechanical point.

Would you say the same of someone who buys a MB, BMW or Lexus?

And even if they aren't mechanically minded, there is something in the way a luxury RWD rides, handles and steers that sets them apart from the others. As BMW said "pure driving pleasure". You sure as hell don't get that in some FWD V6 pussbox. Torquesteer is for peasants

[Polyal]

Yeah a decent Lincoln on a GWRD platform with the suicide doors would trump the 300C. Pop in Miami and boom.

I agree, I think people are getting over (or already have) Lincoln's being tarted up Fords. They need more substance.

edit: that concept can stay in 2002!

[mik]

i always thought of lincoln as the type of vehicle the president would be driven around in, maybe half the problem is there are so many vehicles on the market, very few are standouts any more, even the once touted luxury brands, like benz, bmw,etc, sort of blend in with a lot of the other shopping cars these days, except for a scant few, rolls royce and bentley come to mind as ones that still stand out from the crowd.

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by mik

i always thought of lincoln as the type of vehicle the president would be driven around in

It was, from 1939 until the '80s.

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by mik

i always thought of lincoln as the type of vehicle the president would be driven around in

JFK's brains are still in the back of one.

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

JFK's brains are still in the back of one.

Actually they had it detailed and put straight back into service.

Well, not exactly. But the car was re-built and continued service as a presidential limo until 1977, and is now displayed at the Henry Ford Museum in Detroit.

http://www.thehenryford.org/research/kennedyLimo.aspx

[Bossxr8]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Actually they had it detailed and put straight back into service.

Well, not exactly. But the car was re-built and continued service as a presidential limo until 1977, and is now displayed at the Henry Ford Museum in Detroit.

http://www.thehenryford.org/research/kennedyLimo.aspx

First thing they did was put a roof on it of course.

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by tranquilized

Actually they had it detailed and put straight back into service.

Well, not exactly. But the car was re-built and continued service as a presidential limo until 1977, and is now displayed at the Henry Ford Museum in Detroit.

http://www.thehenryford.org/research/kennedyLimo.aspx

I've seen that car! They also have FDR's '39 "Sunshine Special" Lincoln limo, the '50 Lincoln Cosmopolitan limo from the Eisenhower years, and the '72 Lincoln limo built for Nixon. They're very impressive cars in person.

If any of you ever visit Dearborn, don't miss the Henry Ford Museum.

[tranquilized]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

I've seen that car! They also have FDR's '39 "Sunshine Special" Lincoln limo, the '50 Lincoln Cosmopolitan limo from the Eisenhower years, and the '72 Lincoln limo built for Nixon. They're very impressive cars in person.

If any of you ever visit Dearborn, don't miss the Henry Ford Museum.

Totally agree, I visited the museum in 2010 and thought it was amazing. So did the mates i dragged along with me, and they aren't car guys at all. Can't recall seeing those other presidential limos though.

[RASER]

Originally Posted by Bossxr8

JFK's brains are still in the back of one.

OUCH!

But true....

[Nic302ef]

Doesnt ford put Mercury in the same Basket as the Lincoln name plate, chuck it on some high spec models every now and then.

[MethodX]

Mercurey has been killed off. Last year was the last year of the brand.
Shame they have some classics too.
Cougar, Marauder, the coupes.

[Nic302ef]

The Mercury style Ford Explorer was a perfect spicimen

[Luke Plaizier]

Does Lincoln do sports luxury? That's what's holding them back. Lexus, BMW, Cadillac and Mercedes all have a sports model in their range - RWD, handles well, high power.

While Lincoln only do luxury fwd, then the only market you are going to attract is retiries and brand loyalists who don't look under the hood and care only about the thickness and smell of the leather.

Lincoln, get back to us all when you can do Luxury Sports properly. And NOT with FWD. Until then you're a waste of mindspace.


Lukeyson

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by Luke Plaizier

Does Lincoln do sports luxury? That's what's holding them back. Lexus, BMW, Cadillac and Mercedes all have a sports model in their range - RWD, handles well, high power.

They tried that with the Lincoln LS, which shared a chassis with the Jaguar S Type and the two-seat Thunderbird.

It was offered with a V6 or V8, and the V6 was available with a manual transmission. It never really sold that well.

Lincoln rarely emphasized performance in its history, but luxury has traditionally been associated with powerful engines.

Gangster movies of the '30s (set in the '20s) often featured Lincolns as getaway cars. They were known for being fast for the era.

The downsized 1952–1954 Lincolns are often called the Mexican Road Race Lincolns. They were the first Lincolns with OHV engines, and there was a pseudo-factory racing effort with them in La Carrera Panamericana. The cars were highly modified by Bill Stroppe of southern California. His teams did things like hiding pneumatic jacks in the desert so they could change tires quickly.

The next Lincoln that emphasized performance was probably the Mk VII LSC of the '80s. It was built on the same Fox chassis as the Mustang and Thunderbird, and used the 5.0 HO engine. The car was much heavier than a Mustang, but still quick for its day. The Mk VIII debuted the 4.6 DOHC engine and independent rear suspension in 1992.

[Powdered Toast Man]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

They tried that with the Lincoln LS, which shared a chassis with the Jaguar S Type and the two-seat Thunderbird.

It was offered with a V6 or V8, and the V6 was available with a manual transmission. It never really sold that well.

Theres a V8 LS for sale near me. I would consider buying it for the novelty value, but it looks boring, is priced too high, and after reading reviews of it on the net I am lead to believe my BA will run rings around it as a drivers car.

On the other hand there are a few of the same era Caddie SLSs around. In fact I saw one in the metal last weekend, and they look very nice. I dont think I could live with a FWD V8 though.

[Buntz]

Originally Posted by Moby Vic

They tried that with the Lincoln LS, which shared a chassis with the Jaguar S Type and the two-seat Thunderbird.

It was offered with a V6 or V8, and the V6 was available with a manual transmission. It never really sold that well.

As far as I am aware, that platform is still Ford's IP. It's also what's used to under-pin the current Jag's.

The platform parts would be cheaper now to make, and if they co-invested with Jag in wouldn't cost them so much.

However they'd need to make something better looking than the LS. Because it looked like a Korean car.


How boring does that car look Eleanor Ford?

[Moby Vic]

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

As far as I am aware, that platform is still Ford's IP. It's also what's used to under-pin the current Jag's.

The platform parts would be cheaper now to make, and if they co-invested with Jag in wouldn't cost them so much.

However they'd need to make something better looking than the LS. Because it looked like a Korean car.
image

How boring does that car look Eleanor Ford?

That's more than a decade-old chassis now, though.

The LS was a little bland (looks better in colors other than white), but I always thought it was attractive. The S Type was gorgeous, though, but it was a retro design (new interpretation of the Mk II).

On the plus side, you would never guess that the LS and S Type were built on the same chassis—they look nothing alike.

[Ford_The_Win]

Originally Posted by Buntz93ED

However they'd need to make something better looking than the LS. Because it looked like a Korean car.
image

How boring does that car look Eleanor Ford?

Yep, definitely designed for the WW2 generation. Leather wrapped column shifter?