QLD will use GPS technology to capture the location of more than a million vehicle

[csv8]

POLICE will use GPS technology to capture the location of more than a million vehicles on Queensland roads at any one time - and will use it to charge criminals.

The geographic location of about 25,000 registration number plates are being stored by police each week under a trial that has alarmed civil libertarians.

The move is part of the broadened Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) trial, which uses global position systems and cameras fitted in police vehicles.

It means that if a motorist drives past a police car, their position is recorded. It will be stored for a year and one day. The trial will end in June 2014.


While police are using the information to bust unregistered vehicles, sources admit it could also be used to determine who was nearby when certain crimes were committed.

"If a request is made by a police officer for a search of the ANPR database to be conducted and the request is substantiated and approved by a commissioned officer as supporting an investigation or prosecution of a criminal offence, the recorded ANPR information can be lawfully used by the QPS,'' police said in a statement to The Courier-Mail.

YOUR SAY: Should police us

"The Queensland Police Service has strict accountability measures in place to govern the use of automatic numberplate recognition technology for broader law enforcement.''

Last week The Courier-Mail revealed police were tracing the everyday movements of thousands of Queenslanders by routinely accessing detailed phone records.

Even the mobile phone records of their own officers were being pulled, to determine if they had thrown sickies, had sex with police cadets at the academies or where they were if their boss was suspicious about their location on duty.


Queensland Council for Civil Liberties president Andrew Sinclair said the trial and what could be done with the information was concerning.

Mr Sinclair said the trial involved the collection of personal information, which violated the right to privacy and the principles embodied in the Privacy Act.

He said history showed that when a data collection device was created it was not long before it

was turned to other purposes.

"At least there is an act governing the telcos (when police ask for some information) but there's nothing governing how they collect and use the number plates,'' Mr Sinclair said.

"And I'll bet it ends up getting used for all sorts of things. Whether an officer's wife is found in a part of town she's not expected to be, was so and so really having a sickie etc.''

Queensland's acting Privacy Commissioner Lemm Ex said his office had been apprised of the potential use of APNRs in Queensland.

"Number plates are not in themselves personal information. They become personal information if a link can be made between the number and the owner of the registered vehicle,'' Mr Ex said. "Accordingly, the significant factor is not the capture of number plates but rather their recognition - the linking with an individual.

"If that linking is conducted for a law enforcement activities, no privacy issues arise with it.

"There is no provision in the Information Privacy Act for agencies to dispose of personal information when they no longer have a use for it, and only a limited obligation to de-identify health information.''

QPS has trialled the technology previously.
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/q...-1226708605441

[uniacidz]

Wtffff

[GhiaEB]

Big brother is watching!

[Itsme]

Originally Posted by GhiaEB

Big brother is watching!

Big brother has & always will watch you!

Welcome to the world of technology.....

[FGII-XR6]

if it helps place crims at a crime site I'm for it. I can't see how this data could harm me if I don't break the law and if it harms a crim by showing he was at the scene of a crime how is that a bad thing .
the paranoid will of course think the world is out to get them and that it is an ASIO / CIA plot to persecute us all

[Yellow_Festiva]

Originally Posted by au3xr6

if it helps place crims at a crime site I'm for it. I can't see how this data could harm me if I don't break the law and if it harms a crim by showing he was at the scene of a crime how is that a bad thing .
the paranoid will of course think the world is out to get them and that it is an ASIO / CIA plot to persecute us all

I agree. What I would like to see is this same effort and technology being used to pinpoint who was at the scene of a crime by mobile phone signal.

Almost everyone carries a phone....

[FGII-XR6]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

I agree. What I would like to see is this same effort and technology being used to pinpoint who was at the scene of a crime by mobile phone signal.

Almost everyone carries a phone....

That's would be great but as the law stands ( federal law) it is illegal without a warrant. as the numberplate recognition system is legal under state law with no overriding federal law this system is easy to justify but phone tracking is a legal minefield relying on 3rd party data. The day may come but it would require state / federal cooperation hardly likely to happen unfortunatly

[devilcv8]

Originally Posted by au3xr6

if it helps place crims at a crime site I'm for it. I can't see how this data could harm me if I don't break the law and if it harms a crim by showing he was at the scene of a crime how is that a bad thing .
the paranoid will of course think the world is out to get them and that it is an ASIO / CIA plot to persecute us all

Obviously you'll have no problem if the police decide to search your car because you happened to be in the area of a crime. Or while they are at it you'll have no issue if they search your home, your work or have you assist with their enquiries for a few hours, because after all you have nothing to hide, so what harm is there?

[FGII-XR6]

Originally Posted by devilcv8

Obviously you'll have no problem if the police decide to search your car because you happened to be in the area of a crime. Or while they are at it you'll have no issue if they search your home, your work or have you assist with their enquiries for a few hours, because after all you have nothing to hide, so what harm is there?

If they had good reason to suspect me no problem but they won't. they won't search everyone in the area think about the resources required to carry that out on a regular basis. this is what I mean by paranoia. if though there was a crime , my car was seen in the general area and there was a blue XR6 reported at the scene I might see why they would want to look in my car, would I object? no way they are doing a job and by searching my car they then determine I am innocent and move on to other lines of enquiry, simple really

[rancidpunx]

Originally Posted by au3xr6

If they had good reason to suspect me no problem but they won't. they won't search everyone in the area think about the resources required to carry that out on a regular basis. this is what I mean by paranoia. if though there was a crime , my car was seen in the general area and there was a blue XR6 reported at the scene I might see why they would want to look in my car, would I object? no way they are doing a job and by searching my car they then determine I am innocent and move on to other lines of enquiry, simple really

Lets try this another way. This technology takes off and in the next say 2 yrs and a few high profile crimes are solved. The government approves further investment and shortly all cameras on the roads record number plates. Shortly all CCTV cameras are also equipped with the same technology and there is a huge database dedicated to recording everyones movements (Just like Facebook already knows what everyone is doing and where).

A high profile crime is committed and a single Blue XR6 is recorded at the scene WITH YOUR NUMBER PLATE. No other vehicles. Except its not your number plate its a copy. The real crooks clone a car and yours was the template. Unfortunately your at home alone at the time of this event and have no way of proving that. When the police come knocking, its to arrest you, not ask questions you were there and only you, the camera said so. You are guilty and its now up to you to prove your innocent at a great time and expense. Remember that cameras dont lie, just like speed cameras. Even if your not speeding you can still get your picture taken. Your guilty. This example is a bit out there and extreme but you a simple number plate copy away.

As I said though earlier, its this today, something else small tomorrow all "For our own good" and next we have our every movement tracked. Think of it like the Demolition Man movie. Not just cameras everywhere but speakers that hand out fines for bad language. It can and will happen if the sheep are to stupid to question things like this. GPS tracking in cars is already being tested in this country.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by devilcv8

Obviously you'll have no problem if the police decide to search your car because you happened to be in the area of a crime. Or while they are at it you'll have no issue if they search your home, your work or have you assist with their enquiries for a few hours, because after all you have nothing to hide, so what harm is there?

the police are welcome to search my house, my car, my computer or anything at all to do with my life, whenever they wish. i have nothing to hide. perhaps i live a boring life.

[chevypower]

Originally Posted by prydey

the police are welcome to search my house, my car, my computer or anything at all to do with my life, whenever they wish. i have nothing to hide. perhaps i live a boring life.

I hate that argument. I have nothing to hide either, I still don't want to be on camera 24/7, tracked by a GPS, or have cops randomly raid my home.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by chevypower

I hate that argument. I have nothing to hide either, I still don't want to be on camera 24/7, tracked by a GPS, or have cops randomly raid my home.

This.

[prydey]

Originally Posted by chevypower

I hate that argument. I have nothing to hide either, I still don't want to be on camera 24/7, tracked by a GPS, or have cops randomly raid my home.

i guess i can cut you a bit of slack as you appear to live in the US, and if the shows we see on TV are to be believed, that sort of thing may happen...

but here... seriously.

like i said. some people watch way too much tv

[JC]

Originally Posted by au3xr6

if it helps place crims at a crime site I'm for it. I can't see how this data could harm me if I don't break the law and if it harms a crim by showing he was at the scene of a crime how is that a bad thing .
the paranoid will of course think the world is out to get them and that it is an ASIO / CIA plot to persecute us all

Pretty much agree with this.....

[Turboconvert]

^^^^
spot on au3xr6. I see it all the time. Those who would oppose this either have something to hide or have serious paranoia and need professional help.

[xtremerus]

The 'I've got nothing to hide' mob can have a group hug.

[FGII-XR6]

so can you tell me how this can cause me any harm ? Paranoia dictates that this is bad but I can see no negatives using sane reasonable thinking . this can and will track down the lowlifes we all complain about . maybe those opposed to this technology can get the tinfoil hats out so they can't detect what you are thinking while you are being logged

Originally Posted by xtremerus

The 'I've got nothing to hide' mob can have a group hug.

[nstg8a]

Pretty simple, if a crimes committed and your in the vicinity then the police could, in theory, use your location as a basis to then use more circumstantial evidence to build an erroneous criminal case against you.

In a perfect world no innocent people would go to jail. It's far from a perfect world.

[tezxr8man]

Originally Posted by au3xr6

so can you tell me how this can cause me any harm ? Paranoia dictates that this is bad but I can see no negatives using sane reasonable thinking . this can and will track down the lowlifes we all complain about . maybe those opposed to this technology can get the tinfoil hats out so they can't detect what you are thinking while you are being logged

it's all good and well if it is used for criminals and that is it but can't see that happening. There are positives but as it is the wrong type of people get away with too much and that isn't going to change with this technology,the only thing that happens is average people's freedoms get eroded more and more by the powers that be.

[Bill M]

Originally Posted by xtremerus

The 'I've got nothing to hide' mob can have a group hug.

Don't forget the group hug!

[Streets]

All well and good if you actually believe this technology will only ever be used for its stated purpose and nothing else

[2011G6E]

Originally Posted by Streets

All well and good if you actually believe this technology will only ever be used for its stated purpose and nothing else

Yes...it will never be used for anything else. At the moment. Trust us.
Like a lot of ideas, it sounds fantastic, and will undoubtedly stop some crimes. But once something like this is in place, you're trusting that every administration from now and into the future will never use it for nefarious purposes.

Originally Posted by rancidpunx

Whilst I have no problem with this in theory, I dont like where it is heading and where it will head after that.

There are to many do gooders in the world on their high horse. "Think of the Children", "If it only saves one life" and all that. In the perfect world this sort of thing works wonders for catching crims but its unlikely to actually work. Number plate thefts go up and there will be a way to now implement the technology to hinder the lives of honest hard working people and impede on our freedom just a little bit more. Suddenly the system becomes a point to point GPS speed trap or big business given access to check sickies.
How would everyone feel about having a GPS ankle bracelet on permanently? That would certainly help the police catch criminals, it would be for our own good right?

This...

[rancidpunx]

Whilst I have no problem with this in theory, I dont like where it is heading and where it will head after that.

There are to many do gooders in the world on their high horse. "Think of the Children", "If it only saves one life" and all that. In the perfect world this sort of thing works wonders for catching crims but its unlikely to actually work. Number plate thefts go up and there will be a way to now implement the technology to hinder the lives of honest hard working people and impede on our freedom just a little bit more. Suddenly the system becomes a point to point GPS speed trap or big business given access to check sickies.
How would everyone feel about having a GPS ankle bracelet on permanently? That would certainly help the police catch criminals, it would be for our own good right?

[barnz_xr8]

welcome to the people republic of the soviet Queensland
the PPSQ, we love the you ( next they will be asking every one to spy on each other.

[fte50]

All the do gooders can finally celebrate - another positive program to help rid evil from our lives.
The only problem is Satan is at the controls. It first began as pet registration tracking, now car tracking and IT WILL finally become people tracking as others have suggested.

Whats next ???

[2011G6E]

Yes...it's not the technology as such that you have to worry about. It has many potential benefits that anyone can see. But that isn't really the argument...

It's who's using it now, and more importantly who's going to be using it and what for in the future, that's the vitally important part...

[jpd80]

How long until government insists on every car having some sort of E tag to do all kinds of live vehicle tracking,
such an Orwellian system could monitor all cars for speeding at the one time and continuously,
it could also be used to monitor hours travelled and other violations like failing to stop at stop signs, running red lights,
all kinds of stuff that sound great for the government but trample the privacy and rights of citizens not to be continually surveiled.

[nstg8a]

Originally Posted by jpd80

How long until government insists on every car having some sort of E tag to do all kinds of live vehicle tracking,
such an Orwellian system could monitor all cars for speeding at the one time and continuously,
it could also be used to monitor hours travelled and other violations like failing to stop at stop signs, running red lights,
all kinds of stuff that sound great for the government but trample the privacy and rights of citizens not to be continually surveiled.

If they roll out number plate recognition cameras more then they won't need e tag style monitoring, because every camera you drive past will log your business.

[Franco Cozzo]

George Orwell's 1984 was meant to be a warning, not a guide. I bet you Queenslanders aren't laughing anymore about the opposing political party having less seats than your scooter now lol.