Queensland Police Speed Cameras NO Affect to Road Toll..

[csv8]

"Queensland Police have issued an additional 2695 speeding tickets in the first quarter of this financial year compared with the same period last year, bringing in at least $423,000 of additional revenue.

The main change in policing speed has been the removal of warning signs indicating the presence of a speed camera on Queensland roads from July 2015 (the same time that speeding fines also increased in price). Instead, police vans are now adorned with additional police ‘branding’ and in even bigger fonts to compensate.

Queensland road policing command inspector Allan Hales has previously said the warning signs were “too problematic” and a “hazard”, which did nothing to deter speeding motorists.

Considering the lowest speeding fine in Queensland is now $157.00 (for less than 13km/h over), the total amount of $423,000 is likely to be substantially larger as the next level fine is $235.00 (between 13km/h and 20km/h over), with the additional revenue more likely to be above $500,000.

The increase in the number of issued speeding tickets and removal of ‘Speed camera in use’ warning signs comes just two years after tolerance of Queensland’s speed cameras dropped from 10 per cent over the limit before June 2013 to 3km/h in late 2013 (no official tolerance figure has ever been publicly revealed, but sources inside Queensland Police have told CarAdvice that it’s set at 3km/h).

The net effect saw tickets for ‘low-level speeding’ increase by 47 per cent in 2014, majority of which were previously under the tolerance. The difference netted the Queensland Government $5.7 million in additional revenue in that year alone.



Meanwhile, Queensland’s 2015 road toll was 242 – 19 more than in 2014. Queensland Police state that at least 103,000 hours of police time was spent on speed limit enforcement in the 2015 financial year, a more than 50 per cent increase from the same period in 2010, when the road toll came in at 249.

Despite the 50 per cent-plus additional police time spent enforcing speed limits, Queensland’s road toll was only reduced by less than three per cent in those five years, somewhat contrary to Queensland Police’s concrete line that speed cameras save lives.

More interestingly, however, are the actual road deaths that resulted from speeding, which came in at 75 (2009), 55 (2010), 48 (2011), 59 (2012), 47 (2013) and 65 (2014) with 2015 figures shown as 55 up until October of that year – the last date the figures were updated by Queensland transport.

The figures suggest that the rule changes to tolerances for low-level speeding offences had the opposite effect of saving lives in 2014 and 2015 compared with 2012 and 2011, when the 10 per cent tolerance was in affect.

Furthermore, the number of speeding tickets issued by Queensland mobile speed cameras came in at 359,764 in 2012 (59 speed related deaths), 436,080 in 2013 (47 speed related deaths) and 597,959 in 2014 (65 speed related deaths). The figures show a healthy increase in the number of fines issued, but no actual correlation to the reduction of road deaths caused by additional speed camera operation time or ticket issued.

Queensland Police did not respond to a request for comment on this story at time of publication.'
http://www.caradvice.com.au/416913/q...ll-unaffected/

[olfella]

Gee, that is amazing. Despite a 50% increase in resources the death toll increases. Maybe the biggest impact on income but nil effect on road toll could be the removal of warning signs and like in real estate, location, location, location.

[Blueford260]

Pretty much confirms most peoples opinion that speed camera's are just a "flash for cash" and the only thing it contributes to is state revenue.

[jpblue1000]

Helps keep taxes lower but!

[superyob]

So to the many who decry current enforcement techniques, what's the answer? Also, there is no way to tell whether the camera's are effective or not because of the random nature of humanity. There is no such effective mathematical calculation, surely. Where is the evidence that they don't work. What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

[olfella]

Originally Posted by superyob

What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

I think we all know the answer to that question and I think the police themselves are trying to address the matter by being visible and increasing their branding on certain vehicles. So while they are doing there job, IMHO they are being let down by others that have responsibility in this problem. I am not a police basher but would rather think of myself as a police supporter. I do not envy there job one little bit.

And if by enforcement you include siting of fixed cameras, then again I feel this falls outside of the police responsibility.

[cheap]

In the interest of accuracy and truthfulness the coppers need to update their message, Every K over is a Killer (especially to your wallet)

[simon varley]

Originally Posted by superyob

What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

well, NT's unlimited experiment hasn't exactly flooded the hospitals with road trauma cases has it?

[Spurious]

A 3 km tolerance...sheeez, considering the average variables involved regarding vehicle speedometers, I'd recommend that Queenslanders drive a minimum of 5 km below any & all sign posted limits.

I've said it before..."what if NO-ONE sped"?

Christ it's so damned simple. Concentrate on driving, pure & simple. If you are paying 100% attention every second you are behind the wheel, imagine what a difference that would make!
The main problem that I see with modern society is that life, including driving, has become one big ridiculous & dangerous competition. Everybody wants to be in front & everybody wants to win.

So in the famous words of Dr. Phil...."How's that working for ya' "?

[Spurious]

Furthermore...even using cruise control is no guarantee that you'll be immune to a fine.
Just pay attention, it's the only way.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by Spurious

Furthermore...even using cruise control is no guarantee that you'll be immune to a fine.
Just pay attention, it's the only way.

100% spot on, a lot people treat driving as something they do while they do other things.

Pay attention to what you do, and drive within the rules.

Never been fined since the day I decided to do so.

[asagaai]

Originally Posted by simon varley

well, NT's unlimited experiment hasn't exactly flooded the hospitals with road trauma cases has it?

Because generally people do not want to die, or seriously injure someone else. In the NT when I was up there with unrestricted Stewart Hwy, people generally drove to what their car was capable of, and what they perceived as safe. So my TE Cortina with alloy head- I generally cruised along at 140 kph. Going between 150 -160 kph was fatiguing , too much fuel usage, and did not feel safe on corners.

Most people cruised at some 130 kph. Some Porsches 911 cruised safely at 220 kph, a local BMW M3 guy cruised at 180 kph ...people drove to what their capacities and machines allowed.

And guess what- no policing- this was self monitoring by people.

And in the time I was up there, most of the deaths involved fatigue and single vehicle rollovers, and stupidity with alcohol and driving.

Cannot recall 1 incident I heard about of excessive speed of itself causing death/serious injuries in the NT when there were unrestricted speed limits, other than that race where a Japanese driver lost it in a Ferrari going at some 310 kph on a wide curving bend and took out a road Marshall....but this was after I had left and was a race.

I generally agree that heavy populated areas with pedestrians/kids need speed restrictions.

[SYZ]

Victoria is currently introducing even more speed safety cameras. The 2016 road toll is already higher than 2015, which was higher than in 2014, which was higher than 2013.......... you get the idea.

Good job fellas... revenue is not a dirty word.

[1TUFFUTE]

Originally Posted by superyob

So to the many who decry current enforcement techniques, what's the answer? Also, there is no way to tell whether the camera's are effective or not because of the random nature of humanity. There is no such effective mathematical calculation, surely. Where is the evidence that they don't work. What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

There may be no exact answeror equation, but these results certainly show these things for what they are! Revenue raising! Majority of people wouldnt give a rats if they actually put the money back into road safety! They bleat on about it but are only prepared to take our money.....and do nothing about it! No extra road safety! They even took away school driving safety programs

Looking at statistics from other countries in Europe show that 'speed kills' is a load of crap. Road quality and natural traffic flow amoung other things are far more important then some random cameras that just freak people out at ONLY those positions! It does nothing to people everywhere else. Otherwise why are more and more people still dying?
I 100% respect police...but this has always been handled wrong....

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by superyob

So to the many who decry current enforcement techniques, what's the answer? Also, there is no way to tell whether the camera's are effective or not because of the random nature of humanity. There is no such effective mathematical calculation, surely. Where is the evidence that they don't work. What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

Exactly right, there are a million factors that affect road toll, speeding is one we can all control as drivers, unfortunately many still have issues doing this basic task as the revenue raised clearly shows.

Like I have posted here many times over to be booked you have to be doing at least TWO things wrong, the first one you need to be speeding AND you need to be not paying attention to the road ahead or around you. (the only exception there may be unmarked highway cars which are rare and far between these days as the police mantra is High Visibility Policing in relation to road trauma.

It's like drink driving, and now drug driving, people still do this day after day, year after year, and then complain when they get done. Really is it really that hard not to drive drunk or pull cones, or suck on a crack pipe before driving

[SB076]

Originally Posted by superyob

So to the many who decry current enforcement techniques, what's the answer? Also, there is no way to tell whether the camera's are effective or not because of the random nature of humanity. There is no such effective mathematical calculation, surely. Where is the evidence that they don't work. What would be the effect of nil enforcement???

Cameras were never intended to be the answer, they were there to increase revenue (same as parking fines etc) I just wish Govco was honest with the reason why they are there. Plenty of cameras and black spots in my area, yet you never find cameras in black spot areas, simply because the return ($) in not there.

If you want to lower the road toll, its got nothing to do with enforcement and more to do with education. Licenses are too easy to get, new drivers are not required to have professional training

[blueoval]

Originally Posted by SB076

Cameras were never intended to be the answer, they were there to increase revenue (same as parking fines etc) I just wish Govco was honest with the reason why they are there. Plenty of cameras and black spots in my area, yet you never find cameras in black spot areas, simply because the return ($) in not there.

If you want to lower the road toll, its got nothing to do with enforcement and more to do with education. Licenses are too easy to get, new drivers are not required to have professional training

That is what govco are relying on though. Average training with more potential revenue. Imagine if everyone sought training or it became mandatory? The revenue stream would start to dry up and they would reduce the speed limits even more as well as the tolerance to zero in the hope to catch us all out.

Govco won't be honest with their reasons because it will cost them votes at the next election. It's a cash cow that gets passed on from party to party at each election. They know it. Some of us here know it. It's not fair or right morally I agree. But it's the corrupt government and system we live in now, and it's up to us to outsmart this loophole. I have come to realize we are accountable for our own actions. Find a way to beat the system legally.

[olfella]

Like many others and I am no expert but this problem also has them so called experts tossed. However, if it was up to me I would at least attempt to be seen to be 'doing the right thing' by placing them at known black spots and dedicating some of the revenue raised to fixing those black spots as they are known to take lives or put road users in hospital.

[Trump]

Originally Posted by olfella

Like many others and I am no expert but this problem also has them so called experts tossed. However, if it was up to me I would at least attempt to be seen to be 'doing the right thing' by placing them at known black spots and dedicating some of the revenue raised to fixing those black spots as they are known to take lives or put road users in hospital.

Road and traffic engineers know exactly what is required to reduce the road toll in an effective and non-punitive manner. However the powers that be would crucify them if their ideas were made public and reach a wide audience.

[theBlake]

I drive like my nanna, and I still get tickets and it ****** me off.
Always 8-9km over 60k. Always on wide open urban roads. None intentioal speeding as I do my best to stay under but its impossible not to have the odd lapse - ding, gotcha.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by theBlake

I drive like my nanna, and I still get tickets and it ****** me off.
Always 8-9km over 60k. Always on wide open urban roads. None intentioal speeding as I do my best to stay under but its impossible not to have the odd lapse - ding, gotcha.

So what do you actually do while you drive??

I mean you obviously not watching your speedo, as you claim unintentional speeding, and obviously not watching the road ahead as you still get done.

So where is your actual attention while you are (not) in control of a motor vehicle.

[olfella]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

So what do you actually do while you drive??

I mean you obviously not watching your speedo, as you claim unintentional speeding, and obviously not watching the road ahead as you still get done.

So where is your actual attention while you are (not) in control of a motor vehicle.

If he is like me then he is looking for somewhere to go when things go pear shape, trying to maintain the distance between me and the car in front who cannot maintain a steady speed, anticipating what that cyclist besides me is going to do. That is why I have my speed alerts active and why I try to observe what is going on around me rather than looking at my dash board, changing radio stations or playing with my phone. Gee, I dont even smoke any more because that was a distraction!!
If you read the article it stated that the warning signs had been removed so no good looking for them.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by olfella

If he is like me then he is looking for somewhere to go when things go pear shape, trying to maintain the distance between me and the car in front who cannot maintain a steady speed, anticipating what that cyclist besides me is going to do. That is why I have my speed alerts active and why I try to observe what is going on around me rather than looking at my dash board, changing radio stations or playing with my phone. Gee, I dont even smoke any more because that was a distraction!!
If you read the article it stated that the warning signs had been removed so no good looking for them.

Your response tells me that you completely missed the point of what I wrote.

No need to look for signs, just need to be aware of your surroundings and in control of your vehicle.

Anyone that can't do that should probably be catching public transport.

I love how people come up with a million excuses as to why they speed or why they get booked, but at the end of the day no one else is to blame but the person in the drivers seat, the blame stops there.

I used to get fined lots, and at one stage many years ago was close to losing my license, at the time I had a missus, a baby and a huge mortgage, and was paying for those things by having a drivers license and driving around 1000-2000km/week doing maintenance work all over the state and being 100% reliant on my license.

I made a conscious decision at that time with one point left to not speed and obey all traffic laws, and have not had a single fine since, and that was around 13 years ago.

Goes to prove that if you obey the road rules you will not get fined.

And previous to making that decision every fine I got was because I was doing the wrong thing, mostly knowingly doing the wrong thing, not because of revenue raising, not because the government lowered tolerances, not because the cop was picking on me, not because my mum did not breast feed me or because I did not get enough hugs as a child or because the cop was having a bad day etc etc, but because I as the driver and person in control of a motor vehicle was not abiding by the laws/rules and regulations that I agreed to abide by when I got my NSW drivers license all these years ago.

[Stefan]

Groundhog day thread...

[Charliewool]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Your response tells me that you completely missed the point of what I wrote.

No need to look for signs, just need to be aware of your surroundings and in control of your vehicle.

Anyone that can't do that should probably be catching public transport.

I love how people come up with a million excuses as to why they speed or why they get booked, but at the end of the day no one else is to blame but the person in the drivers seat, the blame stops there.

I used to get fined lots, and at one stage many years ago was close to losing my license, at the time I had a missus, a baby and a huge mortgage, and was paying for those things by having a drivers license and driving around 1000-2000km/week doing maintenance work all over the state and being 100% reliant on my license.

I made a conscious decision at that time with one point left to not speed and obey all traffic laws, and have not had a single fine since, and that was around 13 years ago.

Goes to prove that if you obey the road rules you will not get fined.

And previous to making that decision every fine I got was because I was doing the wrong thing, mostly knowingly doing the wrong thing, not because of revenue raising, not because the government lowered tolerances, not because the cop was picking on me, not because my mum did not breast feed me or because I did not get enough hugs as a child or because the cop was having a bad day etc etc, but because I as the driver and person in control of a motor vehicle was not abiding by the laws/rules and regulations that I agreed to abide by when I got my NSW drivers license all these years ago.

Forget getting George Pell back...
Instead, I'd suggest we promptly get YOU to the Vatican to receive your much deserved Sainthood!...

[olfella]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Your response tells me that you completely missed the point of what I wrote.

No need to look for signs, just need to be aware of your surroundings and in control of your vehicle.

Anyone that can't do that should probably be catching public transport.

I love how people come up with a million excuses as to why they speed or why they get booked, but at the end of the day no one else is to blame but the person in the drivers seat, the blame stops there.

I used to get fined lots, and at one stage many years ago was close to losing my license, at the time I had a missus, a baby and a huge mortgage, and was paying for those things by having a drivers license and driving around 1000-2000km/week doing maintenance work all over the state and being 100% reliant on my license.

I made a conscious decision at that time with one point left to not speed and obey all traffic laws, and have not had a single fine since, and that was around 13 years ago.

Goes to prove that if you obey the road rules you will not get fined.

And previous to making that decision every fine I got was because I was doing the wrong thing, mostly knowingly doing the wrong thing, not because of revenue raising, not because the government lowered tolerances, not because the cop was picking on me, not because my mum did not breast feed me or because I did not get enough hugs as a child or because the cop was having a bad day etc etc, but because I as the driver and person in control of a motor vehicle was not abiding by the laws/rules and regulations that I agreed to abide by when I got my NSW drivers license all these years ago.

Well if I did not understand you then I sure as hell dont know what you are on about now. Who said this was about getting fined? YOU made that assumption - not me.

[b0son]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

Anyone that can't do that should probably be catching public transport.

Then the majority of drivers would be using public transport. RTA's own studies show a fairly substantial proportion of drivers speed, and the sheer volume of drivers booked in the low range band supports this.

I would suggest that you, like the bureaucrats, place a disproportionate importance on one's ability to maintain one's speed to within an accuracy of +/- 2kph.

It's like fining people for submitting paperwork in the wrong coloured ink.

[theBlake]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

So what do you actually do while you drive??

I mean you obviously not watching your speedo, as you claim unintentional speeding, and obviously not watching the road ahead as you still get done.

So where is your actual attention while you are (not) in control of a motor vehicle.

Wow. Talk about drawing a long bow. I said "the odd lapse". Can you guarantee you never ever exceed the speed limit.

I must drive past 2-3 mobile speed cameras every week, they are friggin everywhere here. i have picked up 3 tickets in 3 years. The way other people drive, especially nobsicles in twin cab utes, I have no idea how they keep their license.

[XB GS 351 Coupe]

Originally Posted by theBlake

Wow. Talk about drawing a long bow. I said "the odd lapse". Can you guarantee you never ever exceed the speed limit.

I must drive past 2-3 mobile speed cameras every week, they are friggin everywhere here. i have picked up 3 tickets in 3 years. The way other people drive, especially nobsicles in twin cab utes, I have no idea how they keep their license.

WOW three tickets in three years, even when I was driving like an idiot with no regard for the road rules I never managed to get that many in that short a time period.

You must be a good driver

I can guarantee that in the last 13 years I have paid enough attention to my surroundings to not get a ticket

[theBlake]

Originally Posted by XB GS 351 Coupe

I can guarantee that in the last 13 years I have paid enough attention to my surroundings to not get a ticket

You are my hero.