Two Holdens of interest...

[mcflux]

Hmm... lately I have come across two interesting Holdens.

Case #1:

A mate who I haven't seen for years contacted me thru MSN. He's not a car nut, but noted that he has a VS stato with a gen 3 in it. I continuously corrected him on this, saying it's either a 5.0, or he has a WH stato, but he said it was the very last of the series 3s that wouldn't sell, and his was either a 99 or an 00 model, and that a few of them has LS1s put in them. I have no photographic evidence from him about this, as he was more interested in its wheels & duco, but I highly doubt this is the case.

Could he have meant a limited edition 5.7L Aussie V8 stroker model, like a 355 stato?

Case #2:

At work, one of the managers has a VZ Calais. It had a "SUPERCHARGED" badge on it which I found rather interesting & felt the need to see whether it was stick-on rice or was telling the truth. I got to drive it last week, and it had very impressive low-end torque and a distinctive whine when under WOT ;) ;) It's got a 4 speed auto (instead of the 5 speed that VZ Calais' should come with), and when I popped the bonnet, it had a 3.8 V6 with the blower on top! It looked like I was staring into the engine bay of a VS-VY. WTF? Is it a VZ with VY running gear or something? I can take some photos of this in the near future.

Can anyone shed any light on either of these cases? Did holden in fact offer VZs with the blown 3.8/4 speed as an option, and did holden offer a 5.7 (LS1/aussie 5.0 stroker) VS stato?

-Dave-

[Casper]

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

Hmm... lately I have come across two interesting Holdens.

Case #1:

A mate who I haven't seen for years contacted me thru MSN. He's not a car nut, but noted that he has a VS stato with a gen 3 in it. I continuously corrected him on this, saying it's either a 5.0, or he has a WH stato, but he said it was the very last of the series 3s that wouldn't sell, and his was either a 99 or an 00 model, and that a few of them has LS1s put in them. I have no photographic evidence from him about this, as he was more interested in its wheels & duco, but I highly doubt this is the case.

Could he have meant a limited edition 5.7L Aussie V8 stroker model, like a 355 stato?

Case #2:

At work, one of the managers has a VZ Calais. It had a "SUPERCHARGED" badge on it which I found rather interesting & felt the need to see whether it was stick-on rice or was telling the truth. I got to drive it last week, and it had very impressive low-end torque and a distinctive whine when under WOT ;) ;) It's got a 4 speed auto (instead of the 5 speed that VZ Calais' should come with), and when I popped the bonnet, it had a 3.8 V6 with the blower on top! It looked like I was staring into the engine bay of a VS-VY. WTF? Is it a VZ with VY running gear or something? I can take some photos of this in the near future.

Can anyone shed any light on either of these cases? Did holden in fact offer VZs with the blown 3.8/4 speed as an option, and did holden offer a 5.7 (LS1/aussie 5.0 stroker) VS stato?

-Dave-

I'll say that a VS with a factory LS1 is impossible. The LSi wasnt even in the VT series 1 so it is never going to be in a VS. The LSi was simply not released to the public at that time in a Holden.
Oh, and I believe the VT was well and truely out in 99 and certainly out in 00 (I think thats when the LS1 actually started in 2000)

[Ryan]

Doubt it mate.

Probably just a conversion, is the VZ brand new?

[LUXO_8]

the VS stato did continue for a while before WH though, i dont recall any WH Statesmans with the 5litre..... but i seriously doubt they would put the LS1 into the VS........ tell him to give you photographic proof of that one

[Sprint_ED]

yeah casper is right the VT series 2 had the gen III, so i cant see how a car 2 models earlier could have a motor 2 gernerations ahead

[Ryan]

Maybe it might be a one off in the VS and Holden "experimented" with the LS1 in a VS before putting it into the VT.

Chances of that a very low.

[TTNOS8]

In a VS, if it is a 5.7Litre, its not a Gen III. Just a stroked 5.0L

It's be like all the other 215i 5.7 Lite engines like in the Senators, GTSs, Pubsports, and I'm near sure they were available in statos.

In regards to the VZ. Who cares.... :P lol

[Group C]

Originally Posted by TTNOS8

In regards to the VZ. Who cares.... :P lol

: : :
But shouldn't that be 'WHO CARES' to both??

First one is just a typical dick that doesn't know what his car has or hasn't got.
Second is a 6 that they just bolt a puffer on to get it to go.
If he wanted a REAL performance 6, he should'a bought an XR6T!!

Hope
Our
Luck
Doesn't
End
Now...
= :

[klawsterfobik]

i cant see any problems with the Supercharged VZ V6.. am i missing something?

Didnt they offer them from the VSish onwards?

[Cheahman]

You could get the 215i 5.7 Lite, which was just the stroked 5.0L. Id say this is what he has.

[UNR8D]

VS3 stato's had a hsv option of either 5.0L 195I or 5.7 215I/220I blueprint option the latter of which there are probably 3 of as the option cost was 10k from factory for 5kw(WTF) Gen 3 was never out and sep 99 was the LAST of the VS stato's gen 3 wasnt out till oct 00 or there abouts and was NEVER put into the VR/VS shape. (have seen the conversion on a VS commo though and belive it ИИИИing hoots)

VZ were all released with alloytec, no ecotec or L67 S/C V6's were put into them the calais got the alloytec 190 and 5 speed as did stato's and a no cost option on caprice, same mechanical package as SV6 (Still slow POS) maybe he has a VY2?? the calais lights from VY are the same as VZ.

[Group C]

Originally Posted by klawsterfobik

i cant see any problems with the Supercharged VZ V6.. am i missing something?

Yes, looks like you missed this...



That's the prob. with all their products!! : :

[UNR8D]

as much as i would never drive a holden, ease up on the guys not all their products are bad, gotta love the new barina/viva.... maybe we will have FWD commodores *nebura's next time round. with the holden family engine, stroked 2.2L for HSV models. hehe..


ahh i guess we have to take the ИИИИ sometimes.

[LUXO_8]

Originally Posted by UNR8D

the calais lights from VY are the same as VZ.

no they arent, all VZ got new head and tail lights...

calais headlights are SS headlights with chrome inserts....

[OzJavelin]

Remember when the VTII V8s first came out with GenIII, Holden were still selling VSIII utes concurrently with the old 4.9L/5.0L (whatever it was?). From what I've seen with the structural sump and weirdo engine mounts on the LS1, I doubt it's ever an easy task for a customer fabricator to fit it into anything not designed for it ... let alone the factory just "slap" it into the last few VS-boded Statos coming down the production line ..

I concur with everyone else .. it's probably a stroker ..

[LTDHO]

Up until Jun 1999 the VSIII Statesman had a 5.0, from June 1999 the WH had 5.7.
Unless it's a Grange 215, as these had the stroked 5.0 to 5.7.
There was also the Statesman 215, but they were made in 1996 from Jun to Sep. They were also the 5710 (stroker) not the 5665 (Gen 3).

AFAIK, Supercharged 6 was dropped in Calais Julu 2004 with the VYII. Manual was never an option in the last 10 years of Calais. Pop the bonnet and look for yaself at both the SC and the VIN plate.

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Group C

: : :
But shouldn't that be 'WHO CARES' to both??

First one is just a typical dick that doesn't know what his car has or hasn't got.
Second is a 6 that they just bolt a puffer on to get it to go.
If he wanted a REAL performance 6, he should'a bought an XR6T!!

Hope
Our
Luck
Doesn't
End
Now...
= :

There always has to be some inmature moron that has to ruin a thread about Holdens isnt there? _

If you got nothing to add other then just flaming Holdens dont post is all I can say really.

[mcflux]

Thanks for your replies on both cases.

I doubt I'll be able to get any pix of the Stato, so I'm assuming it's a stroked 5 litre. He was adament it was a 5.7, but was unsure about LS1 or not.

As for the supercharged calais, it is definitely a VZ. VZ grille, VZ headlights & tail lights. And it's a manager's car at work, so it's NOT modified. It's engine (and assumingly the 4 speed auto) are definitely VY though. It's not an Alloytec, it's an Ecotec. Looks identical to blown VS-VY 3.8s.

When I next get a chance, I'll book out the Calais for some kind of "site visit" (it's a pool car would you believe) hehe and take some pictures of the engine bay & grille. I will also note the engine/body numbers.

Please keep the thread clean guys, the Holden bashing is wearing thin. And Group C, I don't take kindly to keyboard warriors insulting friends of mine. OK so he's not that knowledgable on his car (hey, maybe he got tricked into thinking it was a stroker/LS1 when he bought it), but there's no need to insult him.

[TTNOS8]

Originally Posted by TTNOS8

In a VS, if it is a 5.7Litre, its not a Gen III. Just a stroked 5.0L

It'd be like all the other 215i 5.7 Lite engines like in the Senators, GTSs, Pubsports, and I'm near sure they were available in statos.

Kinda like I said.

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

He's not a car nut, but noted that he has a VS stato with a gen 3 in it. I continuously corrected him on this, saying it's either a 5.0, or he has a WH stato, but he said it was the very last of the series 3s that wouldn't sell, and his was either a 99 or an 00 model, and that a few of them has LS1s put in them. I have no photographic evidence from him about this, as he was more interested in its wheels & duco, but I highly doubt this is the case.

Could he have meant a limited edition 5.7L Aussie V8 stroker model, like a 355 stato?

He was adament it was a 5.7, but was unsure about LS1 or not.

Story just changed a bit there _2: First he was sure it was a LS1, now he's unsure :

[Cespenar]

At the moment, I'm ex-Holden.
That company is wont to put leftovers or newer motors in their cars as the situation arises.
My VB V8 wagaon had turbo 350 tranny. It was supposed to be a 400 but Holden ran out.
My VN Calais had an early VP motor in it as they ran out of the final VN motor.
Go figure.

[LTDHO]

Originally Posted by Cespenar

My VN Calais had an early VP motor in it as they ran out of the final VN motor.
Go figure.

VP motor was introduced into Commodore (including Calais) in November 1990, 10 months before the VP was bought in. I don't think they 'ran out' It was at the same time the rear brake light was fitted off memory.

[MYVYSS]

Check the the plate on the engine...it should say LS1....simple...really

[Bossxr8]

It would be funny if the VZ had the Ecotec motor in it as it would have less power than the 190 engine it should have. Maybe they just changed the grille, taillights etc.

[ltd]

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

Thanks for your replies on both cases.

I doubt I'll be able to get any pix of the Stato, so I'm assuming it's a stroked 5 litre. He was adament it was a 5.7, but was unsure about LS1 or not.

As for the supercharged calais, it is definitely a VZ. VZ grille, VZ headlights & tail lights. And it's a manager's car at work, so it's NOT modified. It's engine (and assumingly the 4 speed auto) are definitely VY though. It's not an Alloytec, it's an Ecotec. Looks identical to blown VS-VY 3.8s.

When I next get a chance, I'll book out the Calais for some kind of "site visit" (it's a pool car would you believe) hehe and take some pictures of the engine bay & grille. I will also note the engine/body numbers.

Please keep the thread clean guys, the Holden bashing is wearing thin. And Group C, I don't take kindly to keyboard warriors insulting friends of mine. OK so he's not that knowledgable on his car (hey, maybe he got tricked into thinking it was a stroker/LS1 when he bought it), but there's no need to insult him.

Sounds like a parts bin special from holden. A mate bought what he has been assured was a wk caprice, only to find its a wk statesman. The car has the twin dvd screens, but they drop down from the roof, and are not in the headrests as per the caprice. He's actually taking the dealer to court over it, as the compliance plate also states it is a caprice. the interior in it is statesman, and basically the thing is a rebadged statesman.

[mcflux]

Originally Posted by TTNOS8

Story just changed a bit there _2: First he was sure it was a LS1, now he's unsure :

My bad! What I should've said was: He was saying it came out with the "new" V8, which I took to mean as being the Gen 3, and he said it's not the old 5.0. I asked him about this, and said the Gen 3 had a 5.7L capacity, and he said that he was sure it was a 5.7L "new" V8 and added that "well it must be a Gen 3 then". I suppose your previous post (and others' posts) stating that some senators, statos, etc could be had with the 215i would be more accurate.

Originally Posted by Ghia5L

As for the supercharged calais, it is definitely a VZ. VZ grille, VZ headlights & tail lights. And it's a manager's car at work, so it's NOT modified.

As for the VZ... Methinks now it's a VY : because although the grille is massive & has a large VZ style grille, it has chrome around the bottom of the grille, whereas a VZ (this one definitely VZ, has 5 speed and 190 alloytec) Calais didn't have this chrome. Also, Calais rear lights were same on both cars apart from the 190 one having blackouts around reverse & blinkers, while the supercharged one didn't have blackouts (but same internal structure... think of XT vs Futura headlights). Do I need Holden education/trout slappage? Does the Pope ИИИИ in the woods? I never knew VYs had a large grille/badge as well

Photos were taken today but not uploaded yet, as work cameras were booked out and my mate's camera phone was incompatible with ports/software at work.

Somebody start slapping me with a trout over the whole VY/VZ thing! And as for the VS Stato, I guess it's a 215i, as that's the only logical explanation (I initially thought the stroker 5.0 was a GTS-only thing).

BTW I'd choose a blown VY calais over a 190 VZ calais any day!

http://aussievee8.tripod.com/id3.html
http://aussiecars.tripod.com/cars/ho.../vzcalais1.jpg

Note the differences in the lower grille. I didn't notice myself, but I suspect it'll be the final nail in the coffin.

Sorry for the thread :



-Dave-

[mcflux]

1st link works. Just need to scroll down for VYII Calais. The 2nd link worked via google, but I spose it's got some security measure? I basically googled "VYII Calais" and "VZ Calais" in Google Images and found these two links.

Well at least one good thing was learnt from this disasterous thread (for me anyway)... That some VSs had the 5.7 option! I'll leave this thread alone for now. My next reply would be just linking some photos from work (unless there are a few "don't bother" posts :P which I'm kind of expecting after wasting everyone's time)

-Dave-

[XRated]

Good on ya D4V3!!!111 You need to cut and paste the second link into the address bar to see the pic.

[Group C]

Originally Posted by VY18s

There always has to be some inmature moron that has to ruin a thread about Holdens isnt there? _

If you got nothing to add other then just flaming Holdens dont post is all I can say really.

It amazes me that you would take a comment like that, WRITTEN IN JEST (if you know what that means), seriously.
Also, I, like many Ford people, have had all the crap from the Holden guys for years, and now that we are on top again, you have a cry because the *uses baby voice* big, bad, Ford man made a joke about a Holden. BOO HOO...

But whatever you think mate, because it sounds like you're the authority on moronic things.

Ohh, BTW, it's iMmature, not iNmature.
Maybe you should check how to spell it before you write it..._

[Ryan]

Originally Posted by Group C

It amazes me that you would take a comment like that, WRITTEN IN JEST (if you know what that means), seriously.
Also, I, like many Ford people, have had all the crap from the Holden guys for years, and now that we are on top again, you have a cry because the *uses baby voice* big, bad, Ford man made a joke about a Holden. BOO HOO...

But whatever you think mate, because it sounds like you're the authority on moronic things.

Ohh, BTW, it's iMmature, not iNmature.
Maybe you should check how to spell it before you write it..._

This is a decent thread so why ruin it with some childish remark?

"Also, I, like many Ford people, have had all the crap from the Holden guys for years"

Exactly what does that have to do with me? I'm not giving crap to Ford people am I? I'm partically a Ford person myself since my majority of time on the road is spent in a Ford.(I drive a Laser as a Daily)

[mcflux]

Originally Posted by VY18s

This is a decent thread

lol@decent thread. I'm an idiot who can't distinguish a VY from a VZ. And then made a thread about it. Still no pix sorry (for those who are remotely interested in seeing a normal supercharged VY Calais). Probably not worth posting up pix actually, so I'll let the thread die.