new cars without Temp Gauges?

Smoke Pursuit · 07-10-2006, 09:08 PM

Whats the go with new cars not coiming with Temp Gauges these days? Is there some other warning system like light that tells you they are overheating?

:alien2:

LUXO_8 · 07-10-2006, 09:09 PM

what new car doesnt have a temp guage?? i thought it was bad enough that my NC doesnt have an ammeter or oil preasure guage....new car these days you'd imagine would have everything

smoo · 07-10-2006, 09:12 PM

The new Astra. Has a dash light and bell/chime. Bloody stupid idea, can't see why they wouldn't put one in.

Smoke Pursuit · 07-10-2006, 09:14 PM

Yep, and the new Captiva is the same.

Im told more manufacturers are getting away from the extra gauges, for me it seems a bit STUPID, but neways there are times when you forget to look at the gauge, so perhaps a red lighta and an sound warning would be more beneficial in letting you know something was up.

Fairlane · 07-10-2006, 09:36 PM

I absolutely hate not having guages.

I much prefer guages, little crappy warning lights and sissy chimes (which cant be heard), are useless. My old cluster in my EL which had the full temp,fuel,oil pressure, volt meter- it was great.

Not having a temp guage is bad- you cant tell if the car is running hot (not overheating) or running overcool- you dont know anything until its already farked. Bit the same with Oil Pressure, by the time the light is on, you are nearly farked.

Smoke Pursuit · 07-10-2006, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairlane

I absolutely hate not having guages.

I much prefer guages, little crappy warning lights and sissy chimes (which cant be heard), are useless. My old cluster in my EL which had the full temp,fuel,oil pressure, volt meter- it was great.

Not having a temp guage is bad- you cant tell if the car is running hot (not overheating) or running overcool- you dont know anything until its already farked. Bit the same with Oil Pressure, by the time the light is on, you are nearly farked.

Hmm, im very concerned as one of my friends ordered a new Astra last week and i went and never noticed.

Not sure to tell her and cancel the order (if thats possible) or not.

Cant believe a car in this day would not have a bloody temperature gauge.

MITCHAY · 07-10-2006, 09:56 PM

No temp guage now that is weird. What I find also annoying is some turbo cars not having boost guages stock too!

Fairlane · 07-10-2006, 10:12 PM

I wouldnt cancel an order for an Astra just based on that, they are quite a nice car, the guage thing is just annoying.

Smoke Pursuit · 07-10-2006, 10:17 PM

Would or Wouldnt?

blackahcdx · 07-10-2006, 10:18 PM

Lots of cars these days don't have temp gauges! its not just a Holden thing.

The Ford Ka never had one, and certain nissan models don't either.

xfalconz · 07-10-2006, 10:21 PM

I think engine temp is regulated by thermostat and thermo fans.
If the fans are working then they regulate the water temp no matter what conditions you are driving in.
New cars like Astra probabaly dont have a large temp variation and have a more reliable cooling system than older cars.
I am not sure but maybe they also have some sort of overheat protection controlled by the ECU.
If there is a problem then light comes on and alarm sounds.
I guess they figure as long as car is serviced and cooling system maintained then it either works or it doesnt. If it fails then the driver does have a warning.

outback_ute · 07-10-2006, 10:25 PM

Falcons basically don't now either - the gauge shows what the PCM tells it to show from what I understand

xfalconz · 07-10-2006, 10:42 PM

There is a coolant temp sensor which supplies information to ECU about engine temp.
My XR6T the temp gauge can fluctuate a few mm below halfway depending on outside temp, traffic etc.
It is reassuring to have temp gauge but if there was a problem maybe i would notice a warning light first, especially on a freeway run when i generally dont check gauges often.
The temp is either ok or its not, gauge or no gauge, as long as there is some warning device.

Green X · 07-10-2006, 10:45 PM

Idiot light’s I call em, buy the time the flaming thing comes on it’s generally to late and the damage is already being done.

xfalconz · 07-10-2006, 10:49 PM

Point is you dont check gauges all the time when driving.
If you had a gauge and no light its possible to be concentrating on driving and not check gauges for a while.. Then if there is a problem you wouldnt notice until too late.
With a light chances are even if concentrating on road you would notice it.
Having said that i still think gauges are just as important as any warning light..

MITCHAY · 07-10-2006, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xfalconz

Point is you dont check gauges all the time when driving.
If you had a gauge and no light its possible to be concentrating on driving and not check gauges for a while.. Then if there is a problem you wouldnt notice until too late.
With a light chances are even if concentrating on road you would notice it.
Having said that i still think gauges are just as important as any warning light..

I monitor my temp guage more often than I check my rear view mirror!

Lol reminds me of a radio ad that said "Check your bloody guages" or something along those lines for a radiator shop.

needaXYGT · 08-10-2006, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Captiva

where in the hell are the manufactures coming up with these sort names. their weird.

XR Martin · 08-10-2006, 01:44 AM

Toyota Echos dont have them either.

460cixy · 08-10-2006, 07:25 AM

with the amount of cooked cars i see no one seems to watch them anyway. nothing wrong with a light or chime as long as it comes on early enough to prevent damage. older holdens never has a gauge just an idiot light as there called

ratter · 08-10-2006, 07:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Green X

Idiot light’s I call em, buy the time the flaming thing comes on it’s generally to late and the damage is already being done.

It's different these days with computer monitoring everything.

Most customers I talk to that have overheated their engines , did not even see their gauge read hot, did not realise anything was wrong until it let out steam or stopped driving.

Most temp gauges do not register correctly once the water level has dropped as they rely on the water to give the corret temp reading, The BA moniters water temp as well as cylinder head temp.

Fact is that gauges are becoming unnecessary, these days a tacho is not needed by the driver, new cars can be fitted with a shift light or chime (BA) to warn that red line is nearing, With MSD (and others) ignition systems you can programme shifts lights to come at different revs so there is no need to have a tacho on an oldr car also. On my bike although it has a tacho, I have fitted a shift light system which is a series of different color LEDs, it comes on as the revs approach where I have set it, it starts green ,as it gets closer to red line or my shift point more lights come on which are yellow and then the last lights are red

jzab · 09-10-2006, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outback_ute

Falcons basically don't now either - the gauge shows what the PCM tells it to show from what I understand

Falcon temp gauges have a big flat spot in their position, so that it'll stays around the one spot even though the temperature varies. It'll move once it gets hot enough to let the driver know about it - so it's a bit of a light that looks like a guage even now! If you think that's silly it has only been done because of feedback we get from Falcon owners, if the gauge actually moved linearly with the engine temperature then people actually complain that the gauge moves - even though temperature fluctuations are absolutely normal. People expect the gauge to stay in the one spot, so that's what they're given. A light makes a lot of sense as most drivers (not meaning the people on FF) don't look at their temperature gauge anyhow.

EA2BA · 09-10-2006, 08:43 AM

As said, nearly all modern cars will shut down when something is not right to prevent damage, so you really only need a speedo and a tacho but rev limiters take car of that too.

max · 09-10-2006, 11:29 AM

I hope there's no plans to do away with the steering wheel. Now that would take the fun out of driving.

05MkIIFutura · 09-10-2006, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jzab

Falcon temp gauges have a big flat spot in their position,

That point reminded me, temp guages have been shifting away from being a quantative measure to a relative measure for a while now. That is in the VR/VS commodores the temp guage actually reads the temp, whereas in recent Camry's the needle just points to zones in 'Cold', 'Normal' and 'Hot')

I would believe the Falcon does the same now. When the temp is at a "normal" level, the needle points in that flat spot you mentioned. It takes a fair bit to move it from here.

The only problem i see with just having a light and alarm bell is that you cannot monitor the temp once the temp alarm is activated. That is, you can slow a bit and continue driving and see if the needle drops. You just would have to keep driving hoping the engine was cooling and the light disappears.

Dezza · 09-10-2006, 04:54 PM

A couple of years ago Dad snapped the fan belt on the EBII on a hot day, going up hills, with a well loaded car. He didn't notice the temperature gauge until the battery light came on. A red light seems to be more noticable. The temperature gauge was well into the red. He was very lucky. Roadside Assist came, fitted a new fan belt and filled the coolant resevoir, and we drove off. It could have done serious damage to the engine but it didn't. Even the head gasket survived! That has to be one of the most reliable e-series ever

GreenMachine · 09-10-2006, 04:57 PM

Reverse engineering!!

My HG Belmont was awesome in this respect - would run worse and worse and worse then steam would come out the bonnet and just as you pulled over, the little red "Yer Stuffed!" light would come on.

Hopefully, this trend will continue - big, thin steering wheels, manual chokes, foot-operated hi-beam switches... And finally, the re-release of the 179 red motor.

09-10-2006, 05:03 PM

Ever since the AU Falcons temp guage have only measured up to operating temp where there is a flatspot. Then Shoot up if its on the verge of overheating. I'd say most cars with temp guages are like this anyways.

Eaturbo · 09-10-2006, 05:04 PM

It as been done because women more so than men, but men to will see a light or buzer but dont look at guages. The other thing is that a temperature guage will not read or read low if coolant is lost quick so for the brief moment it does get hot if you dont look at guage you miss it, than when you look down next it has already been up to hot and has come back down to normal. This way as soon as it overheats you get a warning and pull over. I drove an AH Astra for a while and they are a great little car and you never miss the guage

DODDO · 09-10-2006, 05:23 PM

Im a Truck mechanic, and they have HEAPS of guages in them; trans temp, diff temps, water temp, oil temp...the list goes on.
Mercedes Benz Actros, the largest truck and most technilogically advaced truck on the market only has a speedo, air tank guage and fuel guage. The rest of the systems al plug into the ECM. If a sensor does pick up a problem, then that fault will appear on screen. This is an advantage as it saves on warranty work; drivers coming in saying one diff is running hotter than the other (according to the guage) but in actual fact, they run the same temp, just the guage reads a little different. Thats how its explained to me by my old TAFE teachers, which in a way makes sense.

Im still a fan of guages though. Something else to look at.