If you got caught smuggling Heroin... - Page 2

LTDHO · 01-12-2005, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EA2BA

NONE at all.

Same

I don't do things hoping to be bailed out!

XB_fairmont · 01-12-2005, 04:32 PM

This guy is young and made stupid mistake, Thank god every dumb thing i did didn't cost me my life.
It's sad that this guy has wasted his whole potential and put a huge burden on his family and friends.

Mr Cube · 01-12-2005, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

Has anyone here had their child executed? I would doubt it. So its very easy to type some easily typed words without true thought "I dont care - hang him"......

Another point to remember. He didnt take drugs (as in administer/shoot up/etc) in Singapore. He wasnt going to traffic those drugs in Singapore. He was in TRANSIT via Singapore to take them to Australia.

None of that heroin hit the streets in Singapore - so why is he bound by those laws? He isnt a drug dealer in Singapore at all?

So HTF can they execute him?

I have very different views (obviously) than others on this situation.

I agree - he is breaking the law - but I believe the law of his 'target' country (which is actually Australia). I believe he most certainly should be punished. No - it shouldnt be death - and no - Singapore should have nothing to do with his punishment.

I don't agree with death either, but that is their law. They also believe that it helps the offender to be better people in the afterlife/rebirth(whole other religous side, whole other debate)

Going by intended market???? How would that work..He was caught in Singapore thereby bound by there laws.. Going on that Schpelle Corby could have said "well I was actually heading to Amsterdam, to drop of to one of the well known coffee shops but thought I would have a stop off in Bali"

Sporty Corty · 01-12-2005, 04:37 PM

How do you know weather or not he was selling them in singapore only thing we know for sure!!!!!!! was that it was taped to his body!!!

I wouldnt trust anything he said. He's a drug dealer....

Maybe he should of taken another route to Australia through a country with lesser sentances for drug traffikers.

I'm sorry but I don't think there are any excuses.

XA Coupsta · 01-12-2005, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Cube

I don't agree with death either, but that is their law. They also believe that it helps the offender to be better people in the afterlife/rebirth(whole other religous side, whole other debate)

Going by intended market???? How would that work..He was caught in Singapore thereby bound by there laws.. Going on that Schpelle Corby could have said "well I was actually heading to Amsterdam, to drop of to one of the well known coffee shops but thought I would have a stop off in Bali"

Not going by the intended market - the intended destination. Did he really 'enter' Singapore? Obviously technically he did - but in practice - he never left that airport, he never sold that heroin on their streets did he? So he hasnt 'infected' them with the scourge of heroin or whatever the justification they are using to hang him.

Schappelle Corby is a very different one - but using your example - she would have been ticketed to go Sydney-Denpasar right. Direct. Amsterdam not in the picture. She gets off in Bali man - she starts walking their streets and interacts in their environment (and will therefore likely buy/sell/use drugs) and is rightfully bound by their laws.

If she had a ticket Sydney-Denpasar-Amsterdam - different story and I cringe to think of the technicalities. But perhaps she wouldnt have left the airport to connect to Amsterdam and therefore same result as what I'm saying here. Bali should then not be able to enforce their laws upon her if she doesnt leave their airport.

I reckon all airports should be bound by international laws - not the country laws.

XA Coupsta · 01-12-2005, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sporty Corty

How do you know weather or not he was selling them in singapore only thing we know for sure!!!!!!! was that it was taped to his body!!!

Mate if he was going to sell it in Singapore - why would he still have it on him getting on the flight to Oz?????

This phenomenon might disappear soon with the emergence of new aircraft which allow massive distances to be travelled non-stop without having to 'hub' or transfer at airports.

Drug mules will have the advantage of travelling direct!

Little info on his arrest.

He fell asleep waiting for his connection to Oz in Changi Aport. He had it all strapped to his body initially - one pack was uncomfortable - or for some reason he took one pack off and put it in his backpack. So one pack on the body, one in his backpack.

After waking he has to rush to make the flight. Backpack (with heroin) goes through the bag scanner at the security checkpoint NO WORRIES. The alarm sounds on that walk through thing you have to go through (could have been his belt, keys, etc). So they give him a quick pat down.

Bang - find the package on him.

If he had put both in his backpack he was through. They didnt pick that one up at all. And if it wasnt for the security alarm going off for whatever reason he would have got through with the pack on his body too.

parawolf · 01-12-2005, 04:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

Has anyone here had their child executed? I would doubt it. So its very easy to type some easily typed words without true thought "I dont care - hang him"......

True and I don't have kids, but be fair in what you are asking, you should ask "how many of you have had your child convicted in a foreign land for transporting drugs?" Far more relevant.

Quote:

Another point to remember. He didnt take drugs (as in administer/shoot up/etc) in Singapore. He wasnt going to traffic those drugs in Singapore. He was in TRANSIT via Singapore to take them to Australia.

So intent matters? What if my neighbour has 45 tonnes of cannibus in their back shed, but wasn't planning to smoke it, sell it or use it. Possession is possession and the amount that this person had was hardly 'personal use' or anything. This is a traffickable amount of herion. Intent doesn't matter.

Quote:

None of that heroin hit the streets in Singapore - so why is he bound by those laws? He isnt a drug dealer in Singapore at all?

Why? because he was caught on Singapore soil with those drugs. The law for drug possession of a traffickable amount is DEATH.

Quote:

So HTF can they execute him?

Because it is Singapore LAW. If you don't like it, don't go there, and in particular, do not traffic drugs in or through Singapore.

Quote:

I have very different views (obviously) than others on this situation.

Obviously, and you are entitled to them. However in another country you might not be entitled to an opinion and could be put to DEATH or arrested for political dissent. How about you picket those campaigns too? Do you not buy any electrical component from the company Texas Instruments?

Quote:

I agree - he is breaking the law - but I believe the law of his 'target' country (which is actually Australia). I believe he most certainly should be punished. No - it shouldnt be death - and no - Singapore should have nothing to do with his punishment.

Sorry but WHAT?! If that is the case, i'll see you later, i'll collect 50 tonnes of Herion and if I get caught at customs using this logic i'll just say, "it's okay mate, i'm going to South America where possession and trafficking is legal!"

When you travel you are liable for local laws until you leave that countries juristiction. If he was caught in the aeroplane by an air marshell he could be tried via UN law as the flight was between two countries potentially operated by a UN federated country.

But he didn't. He was caught with a traffickable amount of Herion in a caught that has zero tolerance. He would have known this.

BA GT-HO · 01-12-2005, 04:53 PM

I am so sick of hearing about this loser.

The Democrats called for a minutes silence and for the PM's cricket match to be called off.. Why? Because someone broke the law in a country that isn't as soft as ours with their drug laws? BOO HOO. Bad luck, he rolled the dice and he lost.. It just annoys me that the minorites always seem to make the loudest noise about issues like this.

80% of people I speak to are just counting down the days until he is swinging with the noose firmly around his neck so they can stop reading about the loser.

parawolf · 01-12-2005, 04:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XA Coupsta

Mate if he was going to sell it in Singapore - why would he still have it on him getting on the flight to Oz?????

This phenomenon might disappear soon with the emergence of new aircraft which allow massive distances to be travelled non-stop without having to 'hub' or transfer at airports.

Again it doesn't matter. He was caught on Singapore soil therefore he is bound my Singapore Law. End of story, end of discussion, thats life.

In regards to travelling long distances, that just means that he would either get picked up in Australia and deported and depending on originating country he will be arrested on arrival unless he has an Australian Passport, which means is subject to Australian Drug Trafficking laws.

Sporty Corty · 01-12-2005, 04:56 PM

The corby case is different, the drugs weren't taped to her body. They were in her luggage there are too many variables to sentence her to death.

This guy had the drugs on him all the time who's to say he didnt go to the loo on the plane and stash some for someone else to collect and then distribute in singapore.

I understand what you are saying but it doesnt matter where his final destination was he was in a position to have an effect everywhere he went.

It was just a matter of where he would get caught???????

I agree that all airports should be bound by an international law one just like singapore.

XRQTOR · 01-12-2005, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESP

They get executed..................we pay.

Box of .32 hollow points cost $52. So assuming they only missed once or twice it shouldn't cost more than $1o, clean up shouldn't be hard.

Blue Oval Mopar Man · 01-12-2005, 05:04 PM

I dont have any problem with Singapore hanging him. Its well known many asian countries have this same law ! Why would you even contemplate breaking their laws ! He was caught in their country with drugs strapped to his body ! WAY GUILTY !!!!! There is no "Its not mine" defence here . if his story is correct , that his brother was owing X amount of dollars for drugs and gambling and was threatened by crims , then why would you risk your own life for it ! I love my younger brother too , thats exactly why I punch ten shades off sh1t out of him when I caught him stoned when he was 15 ! He hated me for a couple of years , but today he thanks me as most of the guys he hung with back then , are still stoned and hopeless! If he were caught in the same situation , I would have told him do it himself ! We wont be arguing over this in about 24 hours because his mum will be mourning the death of one son , while hating the other for getting him there ! She is the one I feel sorry for in all this ! Its far from her fault , she has to suffer from her kids actions ! I wish they had have hung him the day they found him guilty ! I hope they dont stuff around with the bali nine , I am already sick of hearing about that one !

parawolf · 01-12-2005, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sportycorty

I agree that all airports should be bound by an international law one just like singapore.

Why is that? An airport is a commercial entity, not an embassy. It is a place of business, not government. Some may be owned by the government but they are owned by the local state/country government. Just because it is a place where people travel from, that doesn't mean it is 'international waters'.

Where do you draw the line? You have a personal amount of cannibus on you in Melbourne. You are at a bus stop travelling to make up city in another state that 'allows' personal amount of cannibus.

Cannibus is a state matter for small quantities and intent.

Are you subject to Victorian Law or this mystical state Law?

XA Coupsta · 01-12-2005, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

True and I don't have kids, but be fair in what you are asking, you should ask "how many of you have had your child convicted in a foreign land for transporting drugs?" Far more relevant.

Ok so change my question to become more 'relevant' if you must. So whats your answer to it? You didnt give one. Im a parent - and whether my child is a drug trafficker or not - if they are sentenced to death I am not going to give up fighting for them to be spared execution. And im only saying execution. If my child drug traffics - I guess ill be making lots of visits to a jail somewhere.

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

So intent matters? What if my neighbour has 45 tonnes of cannibus in their back shed, but wasn't planning to smoke it, sell it or use it. Possession is possession and the amount that this person had was hardly 'personal use' or anything. This is a traffickable amount of herion. Intent doesn't matter.

Ummm.....yeh intent matters. Many court cases have been won or lost based on 'intent'. The fact remains - none of this heroin hit the streets in Singapore.

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Why? because he was caught on Singapore soil with those drugs. The law for drug possession of a traffickable amount is DEATH.

This is where I believe (and international law experts too) that he isnt on Singapore soil at all. He is in transit at their airport. And airports (especially ones like Singapore where thousands of people transit everday without leaving the airport till their next flight) should be the domain of international law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Because it is Singapore LAW. If you don't like it, don't go there, and in particular, do not traffic drugs in or through Singapore.

Thanks for the lesson. Its obviously law and this kid is now gonna die. My dispute is the application of this law to his situation. And soon you wont have to go through Singapore - just go direct.

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Obviously, and you are entitled to them. However in another country you might not be entitled to an opinion and could be put to DEATH or arrested for political dissent. How about you picket those campaigns too? Do you not buy any electrical component from the company Texas Instruments?

Again - thanks for the lesson. I am in a country where I can be entitled to my opinion. So all I'd ask is you respect mine just like I respect yours. In fact what is your point from that peice?

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Sorry but WHAT?! If that is the case, i'll see you later, i'll collect 50 tonnes of Herion and if I get caught at customs using this logic i'll just say, "it's okay mate, i'm going to South America where possession and trafficking is legal!"

But you've just been caught havent you? In one country going straight to another? The example being debated here is he is in TRANSIT. Not stopping at that country, simply sitting there waiting for his next flight. So no I dont believe you could use that excuse if busted in Australia with 50 tonnes of heroin. Its a totally different scenario.

Hey look - I realise nothing is going to change. This poor soul is going to lose his life. Im simply trying to challenge peoples very strong beliefs on here about how easy it is to simply scream 'lets hang him' like we are back in the neanderthal dark ages of humanity.

XA Coupsta · 01-12-2005, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Why is that? An airport is a commercial entity, not an embassy. It is a place of business, not government. Some may be owned by the government but they are owned by the local state/country government. Just because it is a place where people travel from, that doesn't mean it is 'international waters'.

Where do you draw the line? You have a personal amount of cannibus on you in Melbourne. You are at a bus stop travelling to make up city in another state that 'allows' personal amount of cannibus.

Cannibus is a state matter for small quantities and intent.

Are you subject to Victorian Law or this mystical state Law?

Man you draw the wildest, uncomparable types of scenarios!

We are talking international trafficking via acraft - and you try and bring up some state/territory example - travelling by bus - with personal usage/possession of cannibus?

Soooooooo different. Not even gonna bother to try and address it.

Psycho Chicken · 01-12-2005, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 42.57lb

I think whoever put forward the suggestion for a minutes silence aught to be put in jail. Elevating a criminal to the staus of a war veteran who died in combat fighting to save this country should be a crime punishable in some way or another.

God yes! That's is the most rediculous idea I have ever heard. Some people might of forgoten how many Australians have already died in Changi. Oh about 64-60 years ago.....

As for the loonies holding some candlelight vigil rubbish in Canberra, where are the candles for the thousands of people who die from drug abuse? The people who get injured or killed by these scum who need money for their next hit?

Hang the *****. Helping his brother out? Good on him. Should of done it legit, like the rest of us. Helping his brother out by praying on thousands of drug addicts. Yeah we should be getting this guy off the hook....

This country is too soft on drugs. I'm not suggesting we start hanging people (although I wouldn't argue with it), but these idiots somehow get the idea they will get a slap on the wrist wherever they get busted with drugs.

As for boycotting Singapore, that's further proof this country is going down the proverbial s***ter.

zetec · 01-12-2005, 05:51 PM

I just want to know who the next completely useless waste of space moron will be who'll pollute my 6:00pm news and haunt my newspapers when he/she decides to go to Asia next week with another few hundred grams of some other illicit substance. I'm sick to death (no pun intended) of these cases, can't people either stop doing stupid crap and expecting not to get caught, or just don't go to Asia at all if you can't stay away from trouble!!

Taking bets on the name of our next drug exporter and where they're from. Perth hasn't had a high profile case yet, so my money's on a West Aussie. Or a Tasmanian.

The Monty · 01-12-2005, 05:54 PM

I cant beleive the first 10 minutes of the 4.30 news was dedicated to a guy who smuggles drugs that kill people. I think the punishment for this kind of thing, in this case would be to make him shoot up 400g of heroin all at once.

:

XA Coupsta · 01-12-2005, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zetec

I just want to know who the next completely useless waste of space moron will be who'll pollute my 6:00pm news and haunt my newspapers when he/she decides to go to Asia next week with another few hundred grams of some other illicit substance. I'm sick to death (no pun intended) of these cases, can't people either stop doing stupid crap and expecting not to get caught, or just don't go to Asia at all if you can't stay away from trouble!!

Taking bets on the name of our next drug exporter and where they're from. Perth hasn't had a high profile case yet, so my money's on a West Aussie. Or a Tasmanian.

Might be a member of your family or a friend huh? Maybe then you might have a different attitude?

Psycho Chicken · 01-12-2005, 06:06 PM

Not in the bloody slightest. If a member of my family is that stupid and weak they can die for all I care.

zetec · 01-12-2005, 06:07 PM

No not really. If you decide to actively do it then you deserve the consequences. I don't want anyone coming from overseas with 400g of heroin any more than I want any member of my family to do the same in reverse. Regardless of who it is, we're not talking a one hour detention for perving on the female teacher's in the toilets, we're talking drugs and regardless of whether you're John Howard, Elton John or Joe Neighbour - You touch drugs, you carry drugs into Asia or you even consider the thought of doing it - you're a damn fool. I'm sick of these people all being innocent or deserving of extra above-the-law status simply because their Mum can't speak English and has had a hard life, or because they're hot and have a great body or simply just because they're an Australian. There IS NOT ONE SINGLE EXCUSE VALID ON THIS EARTH for importing illegal drugs into any country. Just because your life is ed up, don't try to take others out with you.

I can only trust that legal systems like that in Indonesia are just and that if found guilty then we can't just be a bunch of arrogant Aussies and expect these neighbouring South East Asian Countries to bow down to our more "superior" legal system. Our own is hardly bulletproof or fair at times.

At least this idiot could at the very least even if he still had no other choice other than to import drugs (

) could have visited www.google.com.au and typed in something simple like "drugs sentence asia" to see if he got caught what would happen, then either refuse to go to Singapore, or offer to go to another country where he at least can't get instantly killed no questions asked and have half a chance... Sure there's other reasons, like the price of Hero in Singapore is probably really high due to the risk and the stringency of drug control. Dammit you'd get less time, have more fun and probably have a greater chance of getting away if you defrauded someone online or ram raided a servo with a stolen WRX in Sydney for crying out loud. If you're going to be a criminal, at least show SOME brains about it!

LTDHO · 01-12-2005, 07:09 PM

What's this 'what if it was one of your family' talk??

No one can expect to go through life breaking laws with no consequences. It's corny but true 'Do the crime then do the time', now if the sentence is death, your own fault. Think of the lifes saved from the drugs not getting on the streets?

What if one of your family died od heroin overdose???

Woz · 01-12-2005, 07:19 PM

If you're caught smuggling drugs, I don't care what country you're in, you deserve whatever punishment they throw at you.

The life of one person, or the many lives of others down the line?

Something about the Shappelle Corby case had me thinking that maybe she was innocent and a lot of people told me that I only thought that because I thought she was a bit of a spunk, but that other chick who's just been done with the extacy pills and got away deserved all that she got and more.

You do the crime, you do the time.

Thunder · 01-12-2005, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by parawolf

Why is that? An airport is a commercial entity, not an embassy. It is a place of business, not government. Some may be owned by the government but they are owned by the local state/country government. Just because it is a place where people travel from, that doesn't mean it is 'international waters'.......................

Where do you draw the line?..............

Would you rely on this idea as your defence if you were busted carrying drugs? Its a poor excuse that wont help you.

Are you assuming Van Nugyen did NOT know the death penalty in Singapore? or that he knew the laws but thought they did not apply in the airport?

Yes international pressure from all over the world (through UN treaties etc) i think will see the death penalty disapeare over the next 10-20 years, but currently it IS law many countries and i would be very suprised to hear of a drug mule that honestly did not know of a country's death penalty or the penalty's application.

jabba · 01-12-2005, 07:43 PM

Hang the Bastard. Heck I will even volunteer to pull the leaver on the trapdoor. No sympathy for the drug dealing piece of shyte. And what's with this 1 min silence, Mate, I will be cheering out loud.

Thunder · 01-12-2005, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jabba

Hang the Bastard................................ And what's with this 1 min silence, Mate, I will be cheering out loud.

A 1 minute silence is sometimes the ONLY respect we give our diggers for giving the ultimate sacrifice. They dies so we live. I think i minute silece for a convicted drug trafficer does not sit well with me.

Psycho Chicken · 01-12-2005, 07:56 PM

Cheering? Naw, I'm playing Hallowed Be Thy Name.

Couldn't agree more Thunder. Anyone who gives him a minutes silence should be ashamed.

max^power · 01-12-2005, 07:57 PM

if you do something that stupid you deserve any punishment you get - we have to respect the laws of other countries. Dont waste my taxes on drug dealers FFS, there PLENTY of better things to spend it on.

I can't believe the nerve of some people, some idiot on the radio suggested a minute silence for this bloke in singapore! what a joke! ill be happy when it's all over. Perhaps his family will feel some of the pain that his drug taking victims felt with all the crap that he didn't get caught distributing.

trick_xd · 01-12-2005, 08:06 PM

Just think of what other people will be thinking of us aussies
" THEY ARE ALL JUST DRUG DEALERS "
nice way for the rest of the world to see us

and as for this drug dealer . HANG HIM

I heard on the t.v. that it takes $50k a year to look after some one in our prison.
MAYBE the aussie gov should do a deal with singapore . send over all our drug users there .

Thunder · 01-12-2005, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by trick_xd

Just think....................................
I heard on the t.v. that it takes $50k a year to look after some one in our prison.
MAYBE the aussie gov should do a deal with singapore . send over all our drug users there .

Yeh, but what happens with deals like that between countries? It would mean more people selling more fake handbags, sun glasses and watches at the beach here! :Reverend: