Resumes

[flappist]

What is it with political correctness in resumes?

It is that time of year when squillions of people are sending off resumes in the hope they get a job interview.
These things contain hardly any useful information.
Name, list of certificates, what you think you can do and a list of referees (who will not say you are crap will they) is not of much use.

How about Gender? Age? Height? Weight? Location? Background? Smoker? Drivers Licence? Hobbies? Orientation etc etc.
This allows the employer to gauge whether on not you will fit in. There is no point employing someone if they will spend most of their time fighting with the customers/other staff/management over outside issues.
e.g. Ultra rednecks do not do well in multi racial "cosmopolitan" offices or rabid greenies do not do well when the rest of the staff's recreation is pig hunting.

Yes I know in this PC world these things cannot be asked because it is all naughty and private but if you are going to work in a place it is a good idea to be compatable the others there.

The nett result, and this is not just me but many others I know who employ staff, if you provide a PC resume with only the barest of info then you do not even get a look in. It goes straight in the bin or bit bucket.

If anything in a non PC resume prevents you getting an interview then you probably would not have got the job anyway and even if you did you would not last long.

Do yourselves a favour, you never know, you might just get a job......

[T3ts50]

Good luck trying to get a female to put her age and weight in resume

[flappist]

Originally Posted by T3ts50

Good luck trying to get a female to put her age and weight in resume

Well I have employed more then 20 females and ALL of them have but their age and gender, yes maybe weight is a bit of a stretch except in situations where it is important. e.g. general aviation etc.

[4.9 EF Futura]

Dude if you're throwing resumes in the bin because they're too "PC" and you cant be stuffed bringing someone in for an interview....

Then im afraid it is you who is at a loss.

It's a seller's market out there. Employers, depsite what they like to tell themselves, do not have the upper hand and are certainly not in a position to dictate what goes into people's resumes!!

There's a lot to be said about the interview proces....

[bArNsY]

Before they worry about political correctness, maybe they (job searches) should learn how to write a resume properly!
When I was a manager I saw some pathetic examples of resumes, mainly students that just came out of uni.
Sometimes they give you too much information

I guess it all depends on the industry you are involved in

[flappist]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

Dude if you're throwing resumes in the bin because they're too "PC" and you cant be stuffed bringing someone in for an interview....

Then im afraid it is you who is at a loss.

It's a seller's market out there. Employers, depsite what they like to tell themselves, do not have the upper hand and are certainly not in a position to dictate what goes into people's resumes!!

There's a lot to be said about the interview proces....

Yep, definitely a sellers market, that is why I get sent zillions of these things.
The mission impossible/wesley/CES/sarina rosso etc. people all seem to be sitting on their bums all day looking out the window too.

You think I should spend thousands of hours interviewing everyone for a job or would I be better of actually earning money DOING the job.

You can disagree with me, tell me I am wrong or whatever but I actually EMPLOY people and have done so for over twenty years and regardless of what you think employers DO run the show because without them there are no jobs. Well you can always work for yourself.

[4.9 EF Futura]

Originally Posted by flappist

Yep, definitely a sellers market, that is why I get sent zillions of these things.
The mission impossible/wesley/CES/sarina rosso etc. people all seem to be sitting on their bums all day looking out the window too.

You think I should spend thousands of hours interviewing everyone for a job or would I be better of actually earning money DOING the job.

You can disagree with me, tell me I am wrong or whatever but I actually EMPLOY people and have done so for over twenty years and regardless of what you think employers DO run the show because without them there are no jobs. Well you can always work for yourself.

Im not saying your wrong. In reality, going by the theme of many of your posts, id hazard a guess that you're in a fairly specialised line of work.

So, removing specialist appointments from the equation... YES i think employers should spend massive amounts of time interviewing and reviewing applicants. It's a tight labour market out there, you want the "good ones"... then you get off your butt and find them. You'll have to work even harder to retain them.

Of course, this is a realtively short sighted view. Unemployment will pick up, people will be crawling over each other for a job, and then... the employer can make whatever demands it sees fit!!

[flappist]

Originally Posted by 4.9 EF Futura

Im not saying your wrong. In reality, going by the theme of many of your posts, id hazard a guess that you're in a fairly specialised line of work.

So, removing specialist appointments from the equation... YES i think employers should spend massive amounts of time interviewing and reviewing applicants. It's a tight labour market out there, you want the "good ones"... then you get off your butt and find them. You'll have to work even harder to retain them.

Of course, this is a realtively short sighted view. Unemployment will pick up, people will be crawling over each other for a job, and then... the employer can make whatever demands it sees fit!!

I think you are missing the point here. The resume is the first part of the interview process.
If the employer is a devout ultra conservative christian misogonist redneck racist greenie essendon supporter then there is no way an asian muslim female collingwood supporter is going to get the job. This may not be fair but it is the way the world actually is.

I am not talking about Telstra, BHP or the public service here, I am talking about SME, the largest employer in the country.

The idea of this thread is to HELP people get a job. Just because you are really good at the occupation you want to do does not mean you will be automatically be employed.

[Scott]

Thanks Flappist, I've read your opening post and now I'm all fired up..... I better grab a rum.

The sum of what can't be asked so often outweighs the benefit of what can. Potential ability to meet a requirement is only one component of what it takes to land on top.

[XR8putts]

I work at Sunglass Hut durring the uni holidays, and we get 16-24 yearolds (90% female) dropping resumes in everyday. The new craze seems to be adding a photo of themselves! We used to bin resumes as soon as they left (mainly due to no openings) but now win pin up the hotties in the back room

My manager hired the two hottest girls, they only got call backs once we saw their photos. Both are 17 yearsold. My manager and I are the only males that work in the SGhuts in our cluster, we rotate staff as stores are 2-3 minutes walk from one another.

Boy work is exciting durring summer Just a story I thought I should share.

[DOC]

I think every employer would have a different view of the value of a resume.

But if a employer only employes based on that they support essidon , then they should place that fact in the job description saving 15 / 16 applicants wasting thier time, and in that the employer who holds that view may miss employing the best peron for job, as that person was a collingwood supporter.

No wrongs or rights, but i have never employed based on beliefs, but more that a person had the ability to perform the role in question and could work with the team in a positive way.

[Yellow_Festiva]

Well my 2 cents,

I hade to screen a bunch of Canadian Resumes... Some of the information they contained was a joke, others had previous jobs they did but no specifics ie duration of employment or even the company. NIL had age.

Every one had a single line at the end "References upon Request"...

Are you serious??? what a joke! .... you guys waht the job or don't you?? if i was an employer and i had a pile of resumes with references and a pile without do you think i would wait a day or 2 to track down the aplicant to then get the references to then see how good they are???

The amount of "educated" people who have nil common sense astounds me, like people who wrote the University thay attended as only the initials, or shortened their address so that it would make purfect sense to a local, but leave a person from another country wondering what the hell they are on about....

The amount of freely available information in the net on how to write a good resume is hardly ever used based on most of the people i screen.....

[Sourbastard]

Originally Posted by puts99

I work at Sunglass Hut durring the uni holidays, and we get 16-24 yearolds (90% female) dropping resumes in everyday. The new craze seems to be adding a photo of themselves! We used to bin resumes as soon as they left (mainly due to no openings) but now win pin up the hotties in the back room

My manager hired the two hottest girls, they only got call backs once we saw their photos. Both are 17 yearsold. My manager and I are the only males that work in the SGhuts in our cluster, we rotate staff as stores are 2-3 minutes walk from one another.

Boy work is exciting durring summer Just a story I thought I should share.

Sun Glasses Hut wasnt on the form on Career Day when I went to Highschool.

Airline Pilot
Physicist
Chemist
Architect.... oh wait here it is
Sales Droid.

[Scott]

Originally Posted by Yellow_Festiva

Every one had a single line at the end "References upon Request"...

I have no qualms with this in resume's. Many industry's are small and I can understand peoples reluctance to tell the whole world that they are looking to leave one place and join another. References are normally only good news so I am happy to only check them when I know I am about to hire someone.

[4Vman]

Crap, dull, un-informative Resumes is one of my pet hates, that along with people who apply for jobs and cant even meet just one of the job mandatory requirements or pre-requesites!
Read the ad people, if you dont have even some of the job pre-requesites DONT waste everyone's time applying.

[XR8putts]

Originally Posted by sourbastard

Sun Glasses Hut wasnt on the form on Career Day when I went to Highschool.

Airline Pilot
Physicist
Chemist
Architect.... oh wait here it is
Sales Droid.

I'm 20 yearsold, about to start my 3rd year of my 5 year long Bachelor of Architecture / Master of Architecture. Retail is a popular choice amongst fulltime studying students.

Oh hey! - Architect was on your stupid little list! What are the odds? Jackass.

[4Vman]

Originally Posted by puts99

I'm 20 yearsold, about to start my 3rd year of my 5 year long Bachelor of Architecture / Master of Architecture. Retail is a popular choice amongst fulltime studying students.

Oh hey! - Architect was on your stupid little list! What are the odds? Jackass.

Oh dear..... :

[S3SR]

wtf resumes are the easiest thing in the world,

name, age (DOB), gender if its not so obvious

education, high school and university
other things like tafe course

qualifications, bachelor whatever

work history....etc when started when finished or just duration
brief of what was done

most of the time a resume is just so the boss can see where your coming from, but doesnt always end at the paper. make a letter of application, stating why you want the job, why they should choose you, want you want out of the job

then (like myself) when applying if they want one via email, they dont get to see yourself or how commited so i always bring another in, incase they didnt get one..... got the job everytime

resume's should be simple and too the point, explain most/all of it without writing a novel but a job application NEVER ends with a resume.... just shows your looking for money and wont really benefit the business at all

DOB or age, non smoker/smoker, place of residence sometimes, what licence you hold and of course your name should be up the top. weight - its discrimination to not hire based on this so leave it out, background - it shouldnt matter whether your white, black, asian or whatever so leave this out as well

also presentation is the key, dress appropriately (jeans most of the time is inappropriate), make the resume stand out (no colours or over the top fonts), and for fug sake smell nice not like BO or cigar smoke

[Scott]

Originally Posted by FALCONSR

make the resume stand out (no colours or over the top fonts), and for fug sake smell nice not like BO or cigar smoke

I disagree. I say use colours - darker shades of blue for text and graphics such as bullet points or dividing lines and even darker purples for your name on the cover in large text. Good differentiation will help keep you front of mind.

Also, don't be mean with paper and print. Spend a few bucks and buy quality, weighted paper and find a colour laser printer to print it off. Always carry a quality, spare copy with you for not only your reference but also to demonstrate points of ambiguity if they arise.

[congo3sr]

Originally Posted by puts99

I'm 20 yearsold, about to start my 3rd year of my 5 year long Bachelor of Architecture / Master of Architecture. Retail is a popular choice amongst fulltime studying students.

Oh hey! - Architect was on your stupid little list! What are the odds? Jackass.

:
HAHAHA,what a p155er.
all the best for the future.....sunglass boy
cheers,
George

[sarrge2001]

Like it or not the resume is the "first impression" of the job world........

I find usually you can get a reasonable idea of a person from the resume but sometimes things can slp through the cracks.........

Such as the applicant "Stephanie" we had....great resume, sounded perfect.....but all the uni work they brought in in support of their interview was marked "Stephen"........plus it was pretty obvious they were male (either still or at some stage!!)

All the right credentials but probably wouldn't "fit in" with the the rest of the employees........

Sad result but............ that's life!

And another pet peeve with applicants........the "i'm obviously not qualified but i'm a quick learner"..........never mind the 4 year Tafe course you need before we let you loose on "line of life" type equipment!!!! That can work in some industries..........

[uranium_death]

12 inches! Need I list more?

[flappist]

Originally Posted by uranium_death

12 inches! Need I list more?

The correct conversion is 1 inch = 2.54cm not 1cm = 2.54 inches.....

[Falchoon]

With job ads it peeves me when the employer doesn't list the wage/salary in the advertisement. How much money you are going to be paid is one of the most important things about a job IMO, especially if you are thinking of leaving your current job because it is poorly paid.

It can be a lot of hassle and inconvenience to write up an application, attach a resume and then if you are lucky enough to get an interview you might have to take a day off from your current job to attend and after all that you find out the new employer is paying less than the current one.

By the same token the potential employer going over the application, resume and interview would probably prefer not to waste their time either, so why not list the wage in the first place and that way only people seriously interested in that sort of work will apply.

[Hitman]

Q. Why are you applying for this position?
A. I feel that I would be of great benefit to the company, blah blah blah.....
Real Answer. I can do the job and you'll pay me to do it.

References.....
Who in their right mind would list anybody that is not going to give a glowing report? It's pointless even asking for references in my opinion and when I was in a position to hire and fire I never rang a reference for that simple reason. To get the real reference I used to ring their last employer and speak to the manager, reminding them that it's against the law to give a false reference.

[phoon]

Originally Posted by Falchoon

With job ads it peeves me when the employer doesn't list the wage/salary in the advertisement. How much money you are going to be paid is one of the most important things about a job IMO, especially if you are thinking of leaving your current job because it is poorly paid.

It can be a lot of hassle and inconvenience to write up an application, attach a resume and then if you are lucky enough to get an interview you might have to take a day off from your current job to attend and after all that you find out the new employer is paying less than the current one.

By the same token the potential employer going over the application, resume and interview would probably prefer not to waste their time either, so why not list the wage in the first place and that way only people seriously interested in that sort of work will apply.

When I employ through advertising, I always put a wage range ie. from $35k to $45 dependant upon experience. That way I get a good range of people from little experience to lots of experience. After interviewing, the person with little experience may get the job. I base alot of hiring on gut feel at interview time. Whats more important to me than experience is attitude. Somebody with a great attitude can be trained, somebody with a rotten attitude will most likely keep that attitude. The least experienced with agreat attiude may start at the lower end of the pay scale, but I have no hesitation in bringing them up to top end of scale once they prove themselves. Oh, theres also another way to keep good employees from leaving, treat them with respect, whilst money is important, so is a persons self worth.

[XRchic]

I agree flappist, some resumes are just too PC. I dont think anyone should be hired based on any of these things, so it can be hard. But from an employer's perspective, as you say, fitting in can be as important as the skills (which you often can assume to some degree if they are applying for the job at all)...

I work in a workplace when the blandest, most PC resumes possible are required, and everything else is binned. And the result? Often teams who have difficult people, who cause a lot of trouble, who dont fit in, feel insecure, take it out on others, have poor social skills, have opposing beliefs, cultures etc, to many other people and cause dramas about it... and bang! A bunch of harrassment/bullying claims - some genuine, some vexatious.... then you have people on stress leave, long term leave - then productivity goes down because you cant replace those people as they are still technically havent LEFT even though they have been gone for 12 months, and moral is extremely low.

In the end, when a new team member is sought, everyone is very wary and the end result is just little groups of people who dont trust other little groups of people and work not being done properly as a result....

Picking the right people is more than just getting the skills right....

I have seen people with slightly lesser skills go a lot further than some massively qualified people, because they have the people skills, the decent attitude, the friendliness, the pragmatism and who dont take themselves too seriously and are tolerant of others.... in one case, a girl got a job in our team based on her skills alone because her personality didnt come through her written app at all.... no interview either as often is the case.

She was a disaster, and ended up leaving in a big drama which involved police, restraining orders and assault charges and a lot of miserable people... if we could have known her personality and "issues" somehow from her application, she wouldnt have got the foot in the door despite her application.

There is a danger in just labelling a whole person based on their achievements.....

I usually put a brief thing in about hobbies and interests... gives someone a bit of an idea about you.... and I wouldnt care about putting in my age, that I have kids, etc, etc.... people often have more in common with you than not, so often such things are not a big issue.

Just my opinion...

[Sourbastard]

Originally Posted by puts99

I'm 20 yearsold, about to start my 3rd year of my 5 year long Bachelor of Architecture / Master of Architecture. Retail is a popular choice amongst fulltime studying students.

Oh hey! - Architect was on your stupid little list! What are the odds? Jackass.

Cool. So you draw ay? Thats great. Atleast you can afford the crayons.

[GT290]

resume writting has definetly become a skill. Firstly when you see an add which outlines in detail what the job is, what skills are required and what qualifications if any are required.
I will address the competencies with in the cover letter.

My resume will be no more than 2 pages, with an objective, qualifications and information on previous employment that shows my strenghts relitive to the position I am applying for.

I belive the first 2 to 3 seconds is what you are initially aiming at to capture your prosepective employers attention.
My cover letter is what will do the selling and make them interested to know more or read on to the resume. Never send resume with out cover letter.
Never send in all the certificates and crap, save it for the interview
Study the company and have some questions to ask them also
I am not the expert...just had to put nose to grind stone and work this out for my self with hours of trying to get free infor from the net with out paying some one to build it for me at cost of aound $65+ per hour and depending on the level of quality or job you want. Bla bla bla

I tried this site, try putting down a few lines, study it and coose a word you think could be replaced with a more dinamic or buzz type word. try it with this site below
example: I believe I am the right person for the job.....I know you probably won't put that but for the example, punch in believe or the word right, and hit the search, it will give you some words to play with.

http://thesaurus.reference.com/

Now for those of you who are true academies you may not need to have something to spark the brain into a storm of great words to use but the rest of us, I think its great and really help put the letter into a higher academic level showing a wee bit of intelligents, especially if the job is flipping burgers.
Go figure it aye
rubish I say but thats the way the world turns and unfortunatly there a lot of hands out to rip you off along the way.

[XR8putts]

Originally Posted by sourbastard

Cool. So you draw ay? Thats great. Atleast you can afford the crayons.

What does that mean? You really are stupid arn't you. People as dumb as yourself really do need to be taken out of the gene pool.