Phone Lines...

[BuuBox]

I thought I'd ask here for a bit of help on the ol' phone line. Today I decided to climb under my house to see what the cause of some line noise was, and to my dismay, I encountered possible the worst wiring job in the history of home repairs to phone lines. It was split through a Telecom (!) box into three lines, two of which traveled 10 or so meters until nicely terminating in a pile of dirt, while the remaining one went to the point in my lounge, nicely split into the two other points, taped together with electrical tape. To top it off rather than cutting the line to size, meters was simply coiled over beams.

So, short version, I found the source of my line noise! I rewired the telephone points through the Telecom box with the help of a friend, however have one question to ask...The Telephone line has 4 wires: blue, white, red and black. It only had the blue and white wired up, and I did the same.

My question basically is: Are the red and black cables in a telephone line important? I intend to try and get ADSL (again), which was rejected initially for high line noise.

Thanks! Oh, I have no idea if this is the right forum, but since it's an automotive forum, didn't really seem to suit anywhere... ha.

[WizBang]

The Blue / White is the 1st pair into your home and the Red / Black is the spare pair if you want two lines (two phone numbers )you will some times find a 5 pair into new homes these days but i'm not going to give you that colour code
You do not need the 2nd line if you to run ADSL as this will run over your 1st pair and it's up to your carryer to fix the noise which is sounlds like water to me

[MO]

I'm not sure but I think the red/black are part of adsl.
I've got probs getting adsl due the pairing of the wires,am calling telstra to clarify, in my area which has just come online for adsl.

[WizBang]

When they say pairing of the wires this means some where between the Exchange and your house the blue / white wires have crossed (spit pair ) now your phone will still work at the 50 volts but becouse ADSL worke at 120 volts this buggers every thing up

[MO]

Ok I'll hit them with this when I ring and see if they can sort it.

[Ghiadude]

ok dude. i used to work for ***** faults. i can tell you what you need to know.
blue white are usually the first pair going in. the red black are the spare pair(second number) if you have noise then call your carrier, the person you pay line rental for and lodge a fault. tell them it intermittantly goes dead(=fixed quicker) then reapply for adsl, i doubt they knocked it back on noise alone but its worth a shot.
ps its not that adsl runs higher voltage. a split pair "inbalances" the line and causes hum at higher frequencies(adsl)

[BuuBox]

Thanks tx3dude, I'll have to give 'em a call. Thought I'd check the actual lines running through my house first, so yeah. I asked 'em twice on two seperate phone calls why they knocked it back, and both times it was "excessive line noise".

I thought it might be worth reapplying, as just after that they increased the acceptable noise levels, and my neighbour got ADSL.

[T_Terror]

I do contract work for a major carrier.

Got no idea about the ADSL but all you need to worry about are the blue and the white wires.

Dodgy telco wiring is quite common especially with alot of the older Telecom stuff.

Strip the blue and the white and terminate the white on the (2) terminal and the blue on the (6) terminal. Dont worry about the red and black just coil it around the cable sheath and tuck it away so it dosent casue a mess inside the phone point.

If youre still getting noise and youve terminated properly then that means that either the lines are crap and have worn out or there is a carrier fault. Are you with Optus or Telstra or someone else?

The current rules in telco industry are pretty tight so if you make a complaint they should work pretty quick to fix it.

PS: Cant believe you went under youre house, most guys in the job avoid it at all costs. Nothing worse than belly crawling under a house with a muddy floor that has had an extension done on it.

Call youre carrier, make them do it.

[BuuBox]

What's wrong with crawling under the house? I'm no stranger to the deep depths of under-house-extensions, with cat5e and coaxial running from one end of the house to the other. I did as you said, putting the white on the 2 terminal, and the blue on the 6 terminal. I cut the other wires and made sure they weren't shorting etc.

The line noise was only really apparent one one point, that had been conected and spliced in with electrical tape, with nearly 20 meters of aged cable. You should see the pile of left over cable I've got, insane. Seems to have cured the noise... I'm with Telstra, and think I'll give 'em a call tomorrow, see what happens. I'll tell 'em it keeps cutting out, as tx3dude suggested, get the ball rolling. I want ADSL!

[MO]

Well called telstra and this is what they told me.....it has something to do with "pair gains" and because the cable in the street is optic fibre they can't connect adsl because it needs "copper wire " to work.
Now I would 've thought that optic fibre is better and as I know sfa about it thought I would see what you guys think.

[T_Terror]

Originally Posted by John McMaster

Well called telstra and this is what they told me.....it has something to do with "pair gains" and because the cable in the street is optic fibre they can't connect adsl because it needs "copper wire " to work.
Now I would 've thought that optic fibre is better and as I know sfa about it thought I would see what you guys think.

This means youre elligible for BIGPOND CABLE INTERNET not ADSL. ADSL uses the old copper line network to relay information.
ADSL is just an upgrade of the normal phone lines that TELECOM put down enabling them to carry more bandwidth than they were designed for.
Cable internet is designed specifically to do this and uses a hybrid fibre-optic / co-axial network to do this.

Cable internet should theoretically be faster than ADSL anyway. (Key word here is "theroetically", hehe)

[MO]

If by cable you mean satelite dish..yes am eligible the setup cost is minimal but the monthly is outrageous...currently am $29.95 p/m dial up unlimited...telstra offered same for adsl on wire...for sat is $69.95 p/m with 500mb limit.

I was also told keep applying every 3mths...problem is no one could tell me when they will replace optic with copper,so until they get sat at dial up..I'll stick with dial up.

[WizBang]

Ok for a start telstra are giving you the run around becouse if your phone line runs off a pair gain system it is on copper all the way to your home but yes this also means you miss out of ADSL and not fibre as this will have to mean you are running off a rim and the rim will have to upgraded to a C-MUX (this is what I do for telstra ) and the all the streets are cut over to the new copper network
If you want PM and I can see what I can do or find out

[T_Terror]

uuuh no by cable i fibre-optic / co-axial cable.

Optus and Telstra's network is comprised of HFC (Hybrid FibreOptic/ Coaxial) cable. Optus is 100% reliant on this type of cable in its network where telstra uses the copper line network for its telephone and more recently ADSL services.

Copper line was designed and built SOLELY for telephony use, only recent technology has allowed it to be modified for broadband use. Therefore cable internet is a better alternative than ADSL.

Since ADSL is only available in areas with high demand for it i suspect they havent made the neccesary upgrades at your local exchange which is why you cant get it.

See if you can get BIGPOND CABLE INTERNET, if not then yeah satellite is youre only other option.


Hope that helps.

[Donut King]

cable internet is only avaliable in areas where a cable network has been rolled out.

What John has are Pair Gains, where a fiber optic cable is rolled form the exchange to a RIM, which then splits the fiber optic line into many copper lines before going to the houses. It is a cheaper way of doing things than laying solid cables between the exchange and each house. as ADSL needs a pure copper line between the exchange and the recipeient, adsl will not work with a phone line incorporating a PGS.

Telstra can however upgrade a RIM with a CMUX (if there is enough demand in his area) which puts what is effectively a mini DSLAM in the RIM cabinet allowing the users to connect to the adsl network.

More RIM & pair gain info can be found here:
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum...s.cfm?t=147062

with info on which RIM's are planned to be upgraded avaliable here:
http://forums.whirlpool.net.au/forum...es.cfm?t=77896

[MO]

Thanks for that fella's very helpful,now to pressure telstra.

[pauljh74]

If you have street frontage ie not a unit behind other units or in a flat etc, then Optus cable is better value than Telstra anyday for cable. But for ADSL, these companies are one of the last I'd pick.

[T_Terror]

hehe yeah, what DonutKing said.

I was kinda trying to avoid getting technical there.

[MotherNatureVer2]

Just back to the nosiy line bit ........

I know on one of my phone jacks there is very bad noise ..... I currently have my cordless pluged into it but its the same with the normal phone ......... The jack where the normal one is not as bad but you can still hear the noise .........

When I had the phone connected there was a fault on the line & they came out yesterday to fix it ....... the bloke said it was fixed but he wasnt sure for how long :(

Im currently on 14.4bps online & wonder if thats the problem ???????

Im sure the phone lines must have been put in 1858 when the house was built .... hehehehehee I know thats not possible .... but certainly seems that way :P

[MO]

Hey ,Lisa did'nt you get the sat connection you told me about I looked at but the cost was over the top.

[MotherNatureVer2]

John .... I knew I was moving so I put it off till I got here ... no point getting it back in the old house once the decision was made .........

Compared to the cost Im getting at the moment for reconnecting & the speeds Ive got here I think the Sat Net isnt a bad thing ..... remember .... with the 2way Sat theres no phone charges ;)

[T_Terror]

Hey lisa.

If youre geting noise on your line, esecially if its cordells then you have to al;ow for the possibiltiy that is your handset thats causing hte problem.

personally iwouldnt bother trying to figure it out, just clal optus/telstra an tell them that itws their fault and call em ou and let themfigurte out whre the problem lies.

if its teh line itself then they will replace it if its youre handset them you cna replace it for 50bucks

[MotherNatureVer2]

I know its not the handset .... unless a 20k trip in the car has buggered them both !!!! they both worked fine at the old house ;)